onsite感觉很好，还是被拒 - 未名空间MITBBS历史存档

m*n2012-09-25 07:09

1 楼

刚onsite过弯曲一家公司，感觉很好，是我最近四次onsite的感觉最成功的一个，前面
三个都走到了给offer的阶段，其中一家还是这个公司的最大的竞争对手，实力和势头
也比这家公司强不少。
在onsite过程中，他们的hm问我对手公司的offer,然后说假如我们也给你了offer，你
如何选择。我说“This is A tough decision",然后我大致说了一下他们公司的优势，说
要再深入考虑一下。面试的其他几个人都在不断告诉我他们公司相比竞争对手公司的优
势，似乎很想鼓动我加入他们。
这个hr问的另一个问题是我的签证问题，我告诉了实际情况，然后提了他们的竞争对手
评估后认为我的条件可以办O1. HR说他要查查这个签证。
和别的几个面试的都谈的不错，感觉没有遇到什么难的问题。
本来说面试完3-4个工作日给我消息，结果我问时，他们问我竞争对手给offer了吗，我
需要多久时间考虑。我说还没有拿到正式的，但应该快了。然后隔了两天我再问，他们
说距我面试完2周后会有消息。等啊等，昨天刚好了两周，问了一下，说是不match.
我x，没有比我更match的了。难道是我面试感觉错了？
大家分析一下可能是什么原因导致我被拒？我能问一下他们被拒的原因吗？

w*62012-09-25 07:09

2 楼

保持这种感觉，找工作靠缘分，加油。很棒

m*n2012-09-25 07:09

3 楼

据信原文
Hope all is well with you. We would like to sincerely thank you for your
interest and taking the time to interview with us. Unfortunately, we have
received feedback from the team and it looks like we will not be moving
forward at this time. Although there does not seem to be a match with this
particular role we will definitely be in touch with you again if an
opportunity becomes available that suits your profile. I would also
encourage you to check out our job boards for new openings, and feel free to
apply directly. Good luck to you in your search!
Best Regards,

z*O2012-09-25 07:09

4 楼

u r too honest to say "this is a tough decision"..

m*n2012-09-25 07:09

5 楼

that's where I suspect I made a big mistake, but a HR will decline someone
based on that?

f*d2012-09-25 07:09

6 楼

i think they just found an even better fit. i don't think it is because you
said it is a tough decision

【在 m******n 的大作中提到】

: that's where I suspect I made a big mistake, but a HR will decline someone
: based on that?

m*n2012-09-25 07:09

7 楼

I doubt they found a better fit in such a short time.
I was invited for the onsite interview about one week after the team leader
posted the short msg about the opening. So I kind of believe I am the first
candidate they invited for an onsite interview.

you

【在 f**d 的大作中提到】

: i think they just found an even better fit. i don't think it is because you
: said it is a tough decision

t*o2012-09-25 07:09

8 楼

面完你之后又过了两周才给你结果的啊...

leader
first

【在 m******n 的大作中提到】

: I doubt they found a better fit in such a short time.
: I was invited for the onsite interview about one week after the team leader
: posted the short msg about the opening. So I kind of believe I am the first
: candidate they invited for an onsite interview.
:
: you

l*e2012-09-25 07:09

9 楼

不算错，你们频率不对，你自会找到欣赏你的，情投意合的

【在 m******n 的大作中提到】

: that's where I suspect I made a big mistake, but a HR will decline someone
: based on that?

g*e2012-09-25 07:09

10 楼

they just don't want to bi pissed off after giving you the same offer as
their competitors. So the best practice is just reject you, not giving you
chance to reject them. I learned this the hard way.

k*x2012-09-25 07:09

11 楼

learn to lie, in a good way...

，说

【在 m******n 的大作中提到】

: 刚onsite过弯曲一家公司，感觉很好，是我最近四次onsite的感觉最成功的一个，前面
: 三个都走到了给offer的阶段，其中一家还是这个公司的最大的竞争对手，实力和势头
: 也比这家公司强不少。
: 在onsite过程中，他们的hm问我对手公司的offer,然后说假如我们也给你了offer，你
: 如何选择。我说“This is A tough decision",然后我大致说了一下他们公司的优势，说
: 要再深入考虑一下。面试的其他几个人都在不断告诉我他们公司相比竞争对手公司的优
: 势，似乎很想鼓动我加入他们。
: 这个hr问的另一个问题是我的签证问题，我告诉了实际情况，然后提了他们的竞争对手
: 评估后认为我的条件可以办O1. HR说他要查查这个签证。
: 和别的几个面试的都谈的不错，感觉没有遇到什么难的问题。

C*n2012-09-25 07:09

12 楼

有时候不是你的问题，纯粹是运气
会好的，祝你好运

T*k2012-09-25 07:09

13 楼

Sorry to say that you made a big mistake. You seem lacking experiences. A
new graduate?
First, why you told hiring manager you had offers (especially from a
competitor) during interview in the fist place? Of course, they can reject
you based on that alone.
Why? From hiring manager point of view, hiring you most likely will be a
waste of
time. They will think if they give you the offer, you will just use it as
leverage and ask companies entering a bidding war, which they most
definitely don't want to see.
Furthermore, if I were the hiring manager, I want to hire somebody who want
the job, not somebody who consider coming to working for me a "tough
decision" . You don't firmly want to come there, from their point of view.
Just treat interview as a dating process, imagine when you date some
girl, if she tell you "oh, tell the truth, I am already dating another guy (
Implying I just come here to see if you are more handsome than him). ... You
want me to be your girlfriend? ugh, it will be a tough decision, I need
really think about it and can't give you answer right now." What do you
think of her now? Most likely you will be totally turned off.
Looks like you didn't even get formal offers from competitor yet, why you
just jump the gun and told your interviewer about the offer is beyond my
understanding. But next time, remember: only after you got the offer from
the interviewer, then you can consider tell them you recently got offers
from another company when you were waiting for their response and you may
ask them if they can counter-offer, if you really want to do so.
And always remember to tell the interviewer you really like the company and
you WANT this position and you WANT to work for them. Don't ever tell them
it is a tough decision, nothing ruins an interview worse than that line.

y*s2012-09-25 07:09

14 楼

well said. Learn so much from you comments. Thank you very much for sharing
your opinions with us.

【在 T*********k 的大作中提到】

: Sorry to say that you made a big mistake. You seem lacking experiences. A
: new graduate?
: First, why you told hiring manager you had offers (especially from a
: competitor) during interview in the fist place? Of course, they can reject
: you based on that alone.
: Why? From hiring manager point of view, hiring you most likely will be a
: waste of
: time. They will think if they give you the offer, you will just use it as
: leverage and ask companies entering a bidding war, which they most
: definitely don't want to see.

J*o2012-09-25 07:09

15 楼

这种公司相对听上去比较保守，对自己信心也不足，楼主不去也罢。

w*z2012-09-25 07:09

16 楼

有点扯。

【在 T*********k 的大作中提到】

: Sorry to say that you made a big mistake. You seem lacking experiences. A
: new graduate?
: First, why you told hiring manager you had offers (especially from a
: competitor) during interview in the fist place? Of course, they can reject
: you based on that alone.
: Why? From hiring manager point of view, hiring you most likely will be a
: waste of
: time. They will think if they give you the offer, you will just use it as
: leverage and ask companies entering a bidding war, which they most
: definitely don't want to see.

B*i2012-09-25 07:09

17 楼

self feeling doesn't count. they are just not that into you. move on ba.
if they like you, no matter how many other offers you have, they would still
give you an offer.

X*r2012-09-25 07:09

18 楼

我也觉得未必那么回事。
就我个人的在雇主这一方的所见所闻，给不给offer 的决定和申请者是否有其他offer
无关。如果知道申请者有其他offer 反而有助于加快流程。
当然这个各个公司也都不一样。

【在 w**z 的大作中提到】

: 有点扯。

t*h2012-09-25 07:09

19 楼

turned him town because of a (potential) offer? id say this company is so zi
-bei that its not worth working for

【在 T*********k 的大作中提到】

: Sorry to say that you made a big mistake. You seem lacking experiences. A
: new graduate?
: First, why you told hiring manager you had offers (especially from a
: competitor) during interview in the fist place? Of course, they can reject
: you based on that alone.
: Why? From hiring manager point of view, hiring you most likely will be a
: waste of
: time. They will think if they give you the offer, you will just use it as
: leverage and ask companies entering a bidding war, which they most
: definitely don't want to see.

j*e2012-09-25 07:09

20 楼

他们缺乏自信，怕你不去，扫他们面子吧。

c*p2012-09-25 07:09

21 楼

可能有一个和你差不多的，甚至不如你的，但是人家手里没有这么多offer，要的也少一
点。
这种情况下如果你是HM你选谁啊。。

leader
first

【在 m******n 的大作中提到】

: I doubt they found a better fit in such a short time.
: I was invited for the onsite interview about one week after the team leader
: posted the short msg about the opening. So I kind of believe I am the first
: candidate they invited for an onsite interview.
:
: you

k*s2012-09-25 07:09

22 楼

Don't feel too sure about that, and frankly if you want to find a good job
in this tough market, that mentality needs to be changed.
P.S. I also don't believe the "tough decision" remark played any negative
role.

leader
first

【在 m******n 的大作中提到】

: I doubt they found a better fit in such a short time.
: I was invited for the onsite interview about one week after the team leader
: posted the short msg about the opening. So I kind of believe I am the first
: candidate they invited for an onsite interview.
:
: you

T*k2012-09-25 07:09

23 楼

When candidates come down to just a few, normally they are all qualified for
the job, it is a coin flip situation, who wins the offer usually comes down
to a few small things including candidates' attitude towards the company.
All things being equals, if one guy tells the company how great he feel the
opportunity is, how very interested he is in this position and working for
the company, while the other guy tells them he get a lot of offers already
and even they give the offers to him, he will have a tough time to decide.
Whom will you give the offer to, if you are the decision maker?
IMHO, only AFTER you get their offer, then you can tell them about your
other offers, if you decide to let the company to match or beat your
existing offers. This is professional. The other way around is foolish.
Guys have to understand that the interview process is so long and tedious,
even for employers. The process sometimes exceeds 2-3 monthes just to fill a
position. Hiring managers have to manage phone screen appointment, on-site
inteviews and coordinate with headhunter, candidates and company's own
managers and tech persons. They definitely don't want to give an offer to a
guy who don't have strong desire (at least from face value) to work for them
.

N*S2012-09-25 07:09

24 楼

"前面三个都走到了给offer的阶段"
到底是给了offer还是没给啊?看不懂.
是我的中文太差了还是大家的中文都比我好?

S*e2012-09-25 07:09

25 楼

同迷惑

【在 N*********S 的大作中提到】

: "前面三个都走到了给offer的阶段"
: 到底是给了offer还是没给啊?看不懂.
: 是我的中文太差了还是大家的中文都比我好?

e*t2012-09-25 07:09

26 楼

can't agree more. if you have ever be in the hiring manager's shoe, you will
know better. You hire someone who is a good "fit". this means much beyond t
echinical competencies. impression on personality, attitude, and passion, ma
kes a big difference.
sadly, this is many of the Chinese graduates don't do well. Americans are ju
st too good to appear likeable but you only learn the truth after you hire t
hem.

for
down
the

【在 T*********k 的大作中提到】

: When candidates come down to just a few, normally they are all qualified for
: the job, it is a coin flip situation, who wins the offer usually comes down
: to a few small things including candidates' attitude towards the company.
: All things being equals, if one guy tells the company how great he feel the
: opportunity is, how very interested he is in this position and working for
: the company, while the other guy tells them he get a lot of offers already
: and even they give the offers to him, he will have a tough time to decide.
: Whom will you give the offer to, if you are the decision maker?
: IMHO, only AFTER you get their offer, then you can tell them about your
: other offers, if you decide to let the company to match or beat your

l*z2012-09-25 07:09

27 楼

同意，　我不知道楼主是面试什么样的工作．但通常这个有竞争对手也想雇用你所以就
不雇用你的讲法不成立．　我老板的儿子，大学本科刚毕业，同时面试４大会计事务所
，拿到３个ｏｆｆｅｒ，其中两个还是对方已经知道其他公司给了ｏｆｆｅｒ的情况下
给的．因为对方希望他去他们公司做．

【在 w**z 的大作中提到】

: 有点扯。

f*y2012-09-25 07:09

28 楼

我之前申请了一个职位,过了两三个月才给我反馈,我都在入职好久了.
效率低下啊.

f*s2012-09-25 07:09

29 楼

bless

，说

【在 m******n 的大作中提到】

: 刚onsite过弯曲一家公司，感觉很好，是我最近四次onsite的感觉最成功的一个，前面
: 三个都走到了给offer的阶段，其中一家还是这个公司的最大的竞争对手，实力和势头
: 也比这家公司强不少。
: 在onsite过程中，他们的hm问我对手公司的offer,然后说假如我们也给你了offer，你
: 如何选择。我说“This is A tough decision",然后我大致说了一下他们公司的优势，说
: 要再深入考虑一下。面试的其他几个人都在不断告诉我他们公司相比竞争对手公司的优
: 势，似乎很想鼓动我加入他们。
: 这个hr问的另一个问题是我的签证问题，我告诉了实际情况，然后提了他们的竞争对手
: 评估后认为我的条件可以办O1. HR说他要查查这个签证。
: 和别的几个面试的都谈的不错，感觉没有遇到什么难的问题。

c*d2012-09-25 07:09

30 楼

关键是要表现出自己的兴趣。有别的offer可以说，但是你要说我很想加入你们公司，
请给我一个offer，我一定选你。

offer

【在 X****r 的大作中提到】

: 我也觉得未必那么回事。
: 就我个人的在雇主这一方的所见所闻，给不给offer 的决定和申请者是否有其他offer
: 无关。如果知道申请者有其他offer 反而有助于加快流程。
: 当然这个各个公司也都不一样。

g*72012-09-25 07:09

31 楼

应该是给了.

【在 N*********S 的大作中提到】

: "前面三个都走到了给offer的阶段"
: 到底是给了offer还是没给啊?看不懂.
: 是我的中文太差了还是大家的中文都比我好?

k*r2012-09-25 07:09

32 楼

very well said. I feel exactly the same way.
It's not wise to let the potential employer know they will be bidding
against other companies, unless you are a super star to them.
You can always have them counter offer after they extend you the offer. Just
simply let company A know you received another offer from xxx company, even
though you are excited about the opportunity, you need to make it
financially favorable to you. I think everyone will understand and think
this is a professional behavior.
The other thing is that it takes a lot of effort for the hiring team to get
an offer approved and extended. The information you disclosed at your
interview will force them to second guess your willingness for the offer.
They may risk wasting all the time and effort to extend the offer to you and
may leave negative impressions with executive team, politically.
Once again, unless you are a super star in your industry, always try to
impress the interviewer like they are your dream company. Negotiate
carefully AFTER you receive the offer.
Anyway, it's not the end of the world and good luck with your other offers.

for
down
the

【在 T*********k 的大作中提到】

: When candidates come down to just a few, normally they are all qualified for
: the job, it is a coin flip situation, who wins the offer usually comes down
: to a few small things including candidates' attitude towards the company.
: All things being equals, if one guy tells the company how great he feel the
: opportunity is, how very interested he is in this position and working for
: the company, while the other guy tells them he get a lot of offers already
: and even they give the offers to him, he will have a tough time to decide.
: Whom will you give the offer to, if you are the decision maker?
: IMHO, only AFTER you get their offer, then you can tell them about your
: other offers, if you decide to let the company to match or beat your

l*o2012-09-25 07:09

33 楼

没错，面试的公司和职位是你最想要得，想得吃不下，睡不香。拿到offer再据他们。
别说什么在申请别的公司呢之类的，没人喜欢听。

【在 m******n 的大作中提到】

: that's where I suspect I made a big mistake, but a HR will decline someone
: based on that?

d*g2012-09-25 07:09

34 楼

re

you

【在 f**d 的大作中提到】

: i think they just found an even better fit. i don't think it is because you
: said it is a tough decision

c*c2012-09-25 07:09

35 楼

同觉得谈competitors不能算犯了什么错，以我应聘的经历re这个。
被通知去onsite时直接告知已有其他offers结果大大加快流程并以其他offers为底线开
价谈条件。对其他给出offers的也是面试中就提及了同时在谈其他几家，也没影响出
offer...
当然不排除这家公司自己缺乏自信特别怕被拒。。。

offer

【在 X****r 的大作中提到】

: 我也觉得未必那么回事。
: 就我个人的在雇主这一方的所见所闻，给不给offer 的决定和申请者是否有其他offer
: 无关。如果知道申请者有其他offer 反而有助于加快流程。
: 当然这个各个公司也都不一样。

g*w2012-09-25 07:09

36 楼

还是tough decision这个回答，让人觉得即使给你offer，你也不来，干脆不费这力气
，看看别的candidate了。
如果是dream company给offer肯定去的，就不要提了。别人基本上能感觉的出来。

【在 c***c 的大作中提到】

: 同觉得谈competitors不能算犯了什么错，以我应聘的经历re这个。
: 被通知去onsite时直接告知已有其他offers结果大大加快流程并以其他offers为底线开
: 价谈条件。对其他给出offers的也是面试中就提及了同时在谈其他几家，也没影响出
: offer...
: 当然不排除这家公司自己缺乏自信特别怕被拒。。。
:
: offer

l*e2012-09-25 07:09

37 楼

楼主，其实可能没有楼上说的那么复杂。你的immigration status是最大的硬伤。所谓
O签证没多少人办过，而且比H麻烦不少。退一万步来说，现在大公司对于H都不怎么肯
办了。
换了我是HR，如果不是对你很来电，或者HM强烈要求，绝对不会自找麻烦为你张罗办O
签证。现在找工作的人很多，真的，合格的candidate一抓一大把，没必要一定要招外
国人。
换了我是HM，如果不是对你很来电，或者和HR关系很好，一般也不会stand up my neck
来给你发offer。还是太麻烦了。
Move on吧。至于面试过程中提不提竞争对手给了offer，我觉得见仁见智，要看你自身
的实力，背景以及面试人的性格，不能一概而论。

D*Y2012-09-25 07:09

38 楼

How to reply the question: will you accept our offer if we make it?

e*t2012-09-25 07:09

39 楼

Just smile and ask "will you make an offer I can't refuse?"

【在 D*********Y 的大作中提到】

: How to reply the question: will you accept our offer if we make it?

l*d2012-09-25 07:09

40 楼

I will definitely CONSIDER accepting it

【在 D*********Y 的大作中提到】

: How to reply the question: will you accept our offer if we make it?

l*e2012-09-25 07:09

41 楼

看来有必要重新定义一下什么叫作hiring manager。

s*n2012-09-25 07:09

42 楼

我也晕了.

【在 l*****e 的大作中提到】

:
: 看来有必要重新定义一下什么叫作hiring manager。

x*x2012-09-25 07:09

43 楼

LOL

【在 l*****e 的大作中提到】

:
: 看来有必要重新定义一下什么叫作hiring manager。

p*r2012-09-25 07:09

44 楼

不管怎么说，lz在没有拿到正式offer的情况下，就告诉别人自己有offer，这个做法怎
么说也是不妥的。
有句话叫“两头不着岗”，说的就是这种情况。。。A也没办成然后B也没办成。。

i*r2012-09-25 07:09

45 楼

就是lz觉得该给但人家没给

【在 N*********S 的大作中提到】

: "前面三个都走到了给offer的阶段"
: 到底是给了offer还是没给啊?看不懂.
: 是我的中文太差了还是大家的中文都比我好?

s*e2012-09-25 07:09

46 楼

我x，没有比我更match的了
看到这句话我笑了

，说

【在 m******n 的大作中提到】

: 刚onsite过弯曲一家公司，感觉很好，是我最近四次onsite的感觉最成功的一个，前面
: 三个都走到了给offer的阶段，其中一家还是这个公司的最大的竞争对手，实力和势头
: 也比这家公司强不少。
: 在onsite过程中，他们的hm问我对手公司的offer,然后说假如我们也给你了offer，你
: 如何选择。我说“This is A tough decision",然后我大致说了一下他们公司的优势，说
: 要再深入考虑一下。面试的其他几个人都在不断告诉我他们公司相比竞争对手公司的优
: 势，似乎很想鼓动我加入他们。
: 这个hr问的另一个问题是我的签证问题，我告诉了实际情况，然后提了他们的竞争对手
: 评估后认为我的条件可以办O1. HR说他要查查这个签证。
: 和别的几个面试的都谈的不错，感觉没有遇到什么难的问题。