思科和Juniper的操作系统之争：一个还是多个？ - 未名空间MITBBS历史存档

思科和Juniper的操作系统之争：一个还是多个？# EmergingNetworking - 热门网络技术

l*82009-07-12 07:07

1 楼

老婆J2，已和我一起豁免（我的J1明年到期），现持工卡在一公司工作，公司可以给办
H1B，老婆在国内是专升本毕业，只有毕业证，没有学位证，有8年工作经验，不知是否
可以办H1B？需要做学位评估吗？是不是很难申请下来？望诸位指点，万分感谢！

w*l2009-07-12 07:07

2 楼

http://www.tektalk.cn/?p=2377
思科和Juniper的操作系统之争：一个还是多个？
作者杰夫 | 2008-04-23 16:09 | 类型专题分析, 弯曲推荐 | 12条用户评论 »
image 最近几个月来，Juniper公司一直高调宣传他们只有一个操作系统（OS，
Operating System），JUNOS，贯穿其所有产品，大大降低了用户网络的管理成本，不
像其竞争对手，有很多个操作系统，管理困难，…，云云。Juniper所谓的竞争对手，
也就是思科（Cisco），却好像每宣布一个新产品，就推出一个新的操作系统–边缘路
由器ASR 1000的操作系统是IOS XE，网络交换机Nexus 7000的操作系统是NX-OS（详见
相关文章），再加上原有的核心路由器CRS-1（见左图）的操作系统IOS XR，以及思科
传统的IOS操作系统。看起来，Juniper和思科的OS战略有所不同，那么，一个和多个OS
，到底哪个更好？
直觉告诉我们，当然是一个更好。多个不同的OS增加用户的维护成本和学习时间
，很多网络设备用户也表

l*82009-07-12 07:07

3 楼

自己顶一下

z*r2009-07-12 07:07

4 楼

juniper现在产品多了，单一os肯定不可能了

187;
OS

【在 w**l 的大作中提到】

: http://www.tektalk.cn/?p=2377
: 思科和Juniper的操作系统之争：一个还是多个？
: 作者杰夫 | 2008-04-23 16:09 | 类型专题分析, 弯曲推荐 | 12条用户评论 »
: image 最近几个月来，Juniper公司一直高调宣传他们只有一个操作系统（OS，
: Operating System），JUNOS，贯穿其所有产品，大大降低了用户网络的管理成本，不
: 像其竞争对手，有很多个操作系统，管理困难，…，云云。Juniper所谓的竞争对手，
: 也就是思科（Cisco），却好像每宣布一个新产品，就推出一个新的操作系统–边缘路
: 由器ASR 1000的操作系统是IOS XE，网络交换机Nexus 7000的操作系统是NX-OS（详见
: 相关文章），再加上原有的核心路由器CRS-1（见左图）的操作系统IOS XR，以及思科
: 传统的IOS操作系统。看起来，Juniper和思科的OS战略有所不同，那么，一个和多个OS

v*n2009-07-12 07:07

5 楼

Juniper就吹吧。。。
如果说对购入公司技术和产品的整合，思科做的远远好于捷科。。。

187;
OS

【在 w**l 的大作中提到】

: http://www.tektalk.cn/?p=2377
: 思科和Juniper的操作系统之争：一个还是多个？
: 作者杰夫 | 2008-04-23 16:09 | 类型专题分析, 弯曲推荐 | 12条用户评论 »
: image 最近几个月来，Juniper公司一直高调宣传他们只有一个操作系统（OS，
: Operating System），JUNOS，贯穿其所有产品，大大降低了用户网络的管理成本，不
: 像其竞争对手，有很多个操作系统，管理困难，…，云云。Juniper所谓的竞争对手，
: 也就是思科（Cisco），却好像每宣布一个新产品，就推出一个新的操作系统–边缘路
: 由器ASR 1000的操作系统是IOS XE，网络交换机Nexus 7000的操作系统是NX-OS（详见
: 相关文章），再加上原有的核心路由器CRS-1（见左图）的操作系统IOS XR，以及思科
: 传统的IOS操作系统。看起来，Juniper和思科的OS战略有所不同，那么，一个和多个OS

c*a2009-07-12 07:07

6 楼

^^^^^^
这个是什么

【在 v**n 的大作中提到】

: Juniper就吹吧。。。
: 如果说对购入公司技术和产品的整合，思科做的远远好于捷科。。。
:
: 187;
: OS

z*r2009-07-12 07:07

7 楼

就是juniper的中文名称吧，你居然不知道？

【在 c*a 的大作中提到】

:
: ^^^^^^
: 这个是什么

p*g2009-07-12 07:07

8 楼

哦
这个我也是第一次听说过
一直以来我都只知道juniper不知道捷克

【在 z**r 的大作中提到】

: 就是juniper的中文名称吧，你居然不知道？

z*r2009-07-12 07:07

9 楼

很多人都不知道，这个正常，但是他不应该，厚厚

【在 p*****g 的大作中提到】

: 哦
: 这个我也是第一次听说过
: 一直以来我都只知道juniper不知道捷克

c*a2009-07-12 07:07

10 楼

的确不应该:)
不过看到很多中国的SE签名写瞻博网络，就算官方也是这么叫的
http://www.juniper.net/cn/zh/

【在 z**r 的大作中提到】

: 很多人都不知道，这个正常，但是他不应该，厚厚

z*r2009-07-12 07:07

11 楼

这个是后来改名的吧？好像开始时叫捷科来着

【在 c*a 的大作中提到】

: 的确不应该:)
: 不过看到很多中国的SE签名写瞻博网络，就算官方也是这么叫的
: http://www.juniper.net/cn/zh/

a*a2009-07-12 07:07

12 楼

简单就好，别搞那么复杂了。

j*w2009-07-12 07:07

13 楼

For the Cisco part, old and way wrong.

e*w2009-07-12 07:07

14 楼

关于junos的描述也out dated。9.6之后，就是common edge，JUNOSE的code全部移进了
JUNOS，netscreen OS也没有了，花了好几年重新写入了JUNOS。现在unisphere和
netscreen都没有自己的release。只有一套source code。
不过总有一些人不折腾就没有credit。one OS也有内部的烦恼。再过几年再折腾折腾没
准又分了。

187;
OS

【在 w**l 的大作中提到】

: http://www.tektalk.cn/?p=2377
: 思科和Juniper的操作系统之争：一个还是多个？
: 作者杰夫 | 2008-04-23 16:09 | 类型专题分析, 弯曲推荐 | 12条用户评论 »
: image 最近几个月来，Juniper公司一直高调宣传他们只有一个操作系统（OS，
: Operating System），JUNOS，贯穿其所有产品，大大降低了用户网络的管理成本，不
: 像其竞争对手，有很多个操作系统，管理困难，…，云云。Juniper所谓的竞争对手，
: 也就是思科（Cisco），却好像每宣布一个新产品，就推出一个新的操作系统–边缘路
: 由器ASR 1000的操作系统是IOS XE，网络交换机Nexus 7000的操作系统是NX-OS（详见
: 相关文章），再加上原有的核心路由器CRS-1（见左图）的操作系统IOS XR，以及思科
: 传统的IOS操作系统。看起来，Juniper和思科的OS战略有所不同，那么，一个和多个OS

m*d2009-07-12 07:07

15 楼

I've been using IOS for 10+ years, and only 3- years in Junos. but now I'm
Junos lover. :)

e*w2009-07-12 07:07

16 楼

hehe, the grouping by bracket and tagging of XML does make user's life
easier.
I used IOS for 3 years, JUNOS 5 years. Now I love neither.

I'm

【在 m********d 的大作中提到】

: I've been using IOS for 10+ years, and only 3- years in Junos. but now I'm
: Junos lover. :)

z*r2009-07-12 07:07

17 楼

have you ever used IOS XR?

【在 m********d 的大作中提到】

: I've been using IOS for 10+ years, and only 3- years in Junos. but now I'm
: Junos lover. :)

z*r2009-07-12 07:07

18 楼

why neigher?

【在 e**********w 的大作中提到】

: hehe, the grouping by bracket and tagging of XML does make user's life
: easier.
: I used IOS for 3 years, JUNOS 5 years. Now I love neither.
:
: I'm

m*d2009-07-12 07:07

19 楼

not practically, but in a cisco demo. not as good as junos from cli stand
point of view.

m*d2009-07-12 07:07

20 楼

yes, why neither? you have to live with one, or both...

【在 z**r 的大作中提到】

: why neigher?

e*w2009-07-12 07:07

21 楼

I'm evaluating them not only from user CLI experience point of view. JUNOS
main code base is written 13 years ago. It's way behind the modern computer
science technology nowadays. But lazy Juniper people are still sleeping on
the old technology, self-satisfied, while cisco is catching up. Look at how
CRS-3, IOS-XR has really done a good job, incorporating server cluster's
idea into router. That's the key why juniper can only do multi-chassis
system with 4 slaves under 1, but cisco can do as many

【在 m********d 的大作中提到】

: yes, why neither? you have to live with one, or both...

z*r2009-07-12 07:07

22 楼

the one with Linux kernal is IOS XE on ASR1000, not ASR900 which uses XR too

computer
how
does
command

【在 e**********w 的大作中提到】

: I'm evaluating them not only from user CLI experience point of view. JUNOS
: main code base is written 13 years ago. It's way behind the modern computer
: science technology nowadays. But lazy Juniper people are still sleeping on
: the old technology, self-satisfied, while cisco is catching up. Look at how
: CRS-3, IOS-XR has really done a good job, incorporating server cluster's
: idea into router. That's the key why juniper can only do multi-chassis
: system with 4 slaves under 1, but cisco can do as many

L*t2009-07-12 07:07

23 楼

To 歪楼 a bit, the OpenFlow seem to be really making some wave now.
Is it something supposed to be similar to say SS7 in Telecom networks?

【在 v**n 的大作中提到】

: Juniper就吹吧。。。
: 如果说对购入公司技术和产品的整合，思科做的远远好于捷科。。。
:
: 187;
: OS

m*d2009-07-12 07:07

24 楼

"Junos is powerful". this is very important for operating a real large
scale network. think about check BGP route in a full table. you really
can't do much with IOS, but JUNOS can help you a lot.
You can always apply filter to interface for all internet inbound
traffic not having to worry about the performance. On cisco router, we
usually don't do that.
I've been using cisco device ( from 2500 to GSR, no CRS-1 yet, from 2900
to 6500 and N7K/5K/2K ) for 10+ years, only 3+ years on juniper, but I

【在 e**********w 的大作中提到】

: I'm evaluating them not only from user CLI experience point of view. JUNOS
: main code base is written 13 years ago. It's way behind the modern computer
: science technology nowadays. But lazy Juniper people are still sleeping on
: the old technology, self-satisfied, while cisco is catching up. Look at how
: CRS-3, IOS-XR has really done a good job, incorporating server cluster's
: idea into router. That's the key why juniper can only do multi-chassis
: system with 4 slaves under 1, but cisco can do as many

z*r2009-07-12 07:07

25 楼

what is the "thing" that junos can do but ios cannot? can you give more
details?
this sounds like a market slide, hoho

【在 m********d 的大作中提到】

: "Junos is powerful". this is very important for operating a real large
: scale network. think about check BGP route in a full table. you really
: can't do much with IOS, but JUNOS can help you a lot.
: You can always apply filter to interface for all internet inbound
: traffic not having to worry about the performance. On cisco router, we
: usually don't do that.
: I've been using cisco device ( from 2500 to GSR, no CRS-1 yet, from 2900
: to 6500 and N7K/5K/2K ) for 10+ years, only 3+ years on juniper, but I

s*g2009-07-12 07:07

26 楼

"You can always apply filter to interface for all internet inbound
traffic not having to worry about the performance. On cisco router, we
usually don't do that."
Hahahha, this is laughable ... any core router vendor out there in the
market can do traffic filtering at line rate.

【在 m********d 的大作中提到】

: "Junos is powerful". this is very important for operating a real large
: scale network. think about check BGP route in a full table. you really
: can't do much with IOS, but JUNOS can help you a lot.
: You can always apply filter to interface for all internet inbound
: traffic not having to worry about the performance. On cisco router, we
: usually don't do that.
: I've been using cisco device ( from 2500 to GSR, no CRS-1 yet, from 2900
: to 6500 and N7K/5K/2K ) for 10+ years, only 3+ years on juniper, but I

m*d2009-07-12 07:07

27 楼

inactive path from a peer, filtered by specific as-path regex and
community regex... and a lot more.
no, this one is from real experience, but the last I said sounds like
marketing words. :)

【在 z**r 的大作中提到】

:
: what is the "thing" that junos can do but ios cannot? can you give more
: details?
: this sounds like a market slide, hoho

m*d2009-07-12 07:07

28 楼

are you speaking from vendor side or user side? sounds like vendor side...

m*d2009-07-12 07:07

29 楼

and if from user side, it's from your own experience or from what you
believes true? :)
don't know all vendors, but for cisco, ACL is popular way to do
filtering, never tried MQC ( cisco haven't recommended it. :) )
don't like ACL on critical point because:
1. how many times router crashes just because an engineer forgets take
off "log" keyword?
2. maintainning an complex ACL is painful.
3. not very good on statistics.
4. sometimes apply/re-apply causes problem.
of course, I still have to use AC

【在 m********d 的大作中提到】

: are you speaking from vendor side or user side? sounds like vendor side...

e*w2009-07-12 07:07

30 楼

Users definitely get a good experience with JUNOS CLI, coz it has built-in
XML tag and Data Definition Language support. That makes life much easier.
User can even obtain a UNIX command experience with JUNOS CLI by pipe:
show xxx | find
or
show xxx | match
That said, looking into the source code, I guess only vendor guys can do
this, it's obvious that JUNOS lags behind the technology at least 10 years.
IOS is 20+ years old. But the good thing is that Cisco keeps thinking how to
improve it, and a

【在 m********d 的大作中提到】

: "Junos is powerful". this is very important for operating a real large
: scale network. think about check BGP route in a full table. you really
: can't do much with IOS, but JUNOS can help you a lot.
: You can always apply filter to interface for all internet inbound
: traffic not having to worry about the performance. On cisco router, we
: usually don't do that.
: I've been using cisco device ( from 2500 to GSR, no CRS-1 yet, from 2900
: to 6500 and N7K/5K/2K ) for 10+ years, only 3+ years on juniper, but I

t*r2009-07-12 07:07

31 楼

TO 楼上的,
公司内部也在改, 所以你说的这个Juniper, on the contrary, is satisfied and
sleeping on C,
BSD, single thread.实际上现在不是事实.

t*r2009-07-12 07:07

32 楼

TO 楼上的,
公司内部也在改, 所以你说的这个Juniper, on the contrary, is satisfied and
sleeping on C,
BSD, single thread.实际上现在不是事实.

c*i2009-07-12 07:07

33 楼

IOS and IOX also have XML and pipe support. In IOX, you even can access the
ksh to run unix command.

.
to

【在 e**********w 的大作中提到】

: Users definitely get a good experience with JUNOS CLI, coz it has built-in
: XML tag and Data Definition Language support. That makes life much easier.
: User can even obtain a UNIX command experience with JUNOS CLI by pipe:
: show xxx | find
: or
: show xxx | match
: That said, looking into the source code, I guess only vendor guys can do
: this, it's obvious that JUNOS lags behind the technology at least 10 years.
: IOS is 20+ years old. But the good thing is that Cisco keeps thinking how to
: improve it, and a

t*r2009-07-12 07:07

34 楼

JUNOS kernel再不改不行了啊

w*s2009-07-12 07:07

35 楼

C和BSD继续用没什么，不过J真的要跳multithread的火坑么？

【在 t*******r 的大作中提到】

: TO 楼上的,
: 公司内部也在改, 所以你说的这个Juniper, on the contrary, is satisfied and
: sleeping on C,
: BSD, single thread.实际上现在不是事实.

e*w2009-07-12 07:07

36 楼

The planned change 4 years down the road is nothing but restructuring
the code. Even for system companies nowadays, the world has moved
on to C++ and Linux now. BSD is so lack of community support. C++
can make code much cleaner and with better modularity. C and BSD
is last century's software engineering practice.
Even for the restructuring of code, the team doing this, led by non-
production BG, will encounter tremendous obstacles in production BGs.

【在 t*******r 的大作中提到】

: TO 楼上的,
: 公司内部也在改, 所以你说的这个Juniper, on the contrary, is satisfied and
: sleeping on C,
: BSD, single thread.实际上现在不是事实.

e*w2009-07-12 07:07

37 楼

JUNOS support user access shell and execute unix command since 1997.
IOX copied JUNOS on this matter.

the

【在 c*****i 的大作中提到】

: IOS and IOX also have XML and pipe support. In IOX, you even can access the
: ksh to run unix command.
:
: .
: to

z*r2009-07-12 07:07

38 楼

yeah, I've seen many verdors migrated to linux from bsd, say F5. But C++,
don't know who is using it for network protocol programming

【在 e**********w 的大作中提到】

: The planned change 4 years down the road is nothing but restructuring
: the code. Even for system companies nowadays, the world has moved
: on to C++ and Linux now. BSD is so lack of community support. C++
: can make code much cleaner and with better modularity. C and BSD
: is last century's software engineering practice.
: Even for the restructuring of code, the team doing this, led by non-
: production BG, will encounter tremendous obstacles in production BGs.