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History is a guide, VRX reminds me of ELN
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History is a guide, VRX reminds me of ELN# Stock
a*1
1
Elan was an Irish biotech company. It got aggressive in accounting and
acquisition during the stock boom in 2000 and stock ran several fold to 67.
Its problem was later exposed in 2002 and company stock went downward spiral
and its survival was on the line. The stock dropped to $1.
However, it was still a solid company with solid asset, pipeline and drugs
to sell. Later, the stock bounced back to the high of $30 and was
successfully sold.
VRX is very similar to Elan in terms of product line and management behavior
. The problem is it accumulated huge amount of debt ($30B) to finance the
acquisition. When everything goes well, it is a wall street darling. However
, the debt will be a huge issue in current situation.
The upside might be 100%, but the downside can be 90% if it plays out like
ELAN. Having said that, the asset is real and the sum of part is certainly
larger than the whole. When everybody is talking about VRX bankruptcy, you
should be brave.
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s*1
2

他家的药还是有些不错的,这里面还得计算一下,究竟VRX有多依赖高药价,一旦无法
提价,还能否持续产生足够的现金流来不断还债
avatar
c*l
3
问题还远没有解决.不是简单的把店关了就可以的.其实他们这么快把店关了,就是证明
他们有问题了.政府很快会介入调查了.

【在 s******1 的大作中提到】
: 赞
: 他家的药还是有些不错的,这里面还得计算一下,究竟VRX有多依赖高药价,一旦无法
: 提价,还能否持续产生足够的现金流来不断还债

avatar
a*1
4
现在还没人说$30B债务的事情,政府调查后refinance时就会有问题了。到时候很可能
是downward spiral.

【在 c*********l 的大作中提到】
: 问题还远没有解决.不是简单的把店关了就可以的.其实他们这么快把店关了,就是证明
: 他们有问题了.政府很快会介入调查了.

avatar
c*y
5
这事的时机不好,前有总统候选人,国会议员,WSJ,后来才是citron,
加上前俩月最近volatility这么大,大部分投资人不会在这么不确定的事情上浪费感情。
这放到去年,蒙混过去也说不定。
VRX主要是诚信问题,那个100M买十年免费收购philidor的权利就很可疑。
都5.9%的revenue通过philidor了,不被捅出来,都不公布帐。
Ackman早上做报告,辩论说这是这个industry的specialty pharmacy strategy,
不光VRX用,不了解这行,反正感觉水太深。。。
至于那几个影子药店,一样的电话号码,到底是不是做假账,真不好说。
至于citron上挖出,安然的ECO跟VRX CEO讲话如何一致,甚至CFO(?)的背景都是
长年麦肯锡,这就有点过了。

.
spiral
behavior
However

【在 a*****1 的大作中提到】
: Elan was an Irish biotech company. It got aggressive in accounting and
: acquisition during the stock boom in 2000 and stock ran several fold to 67.
: Its problem was later exposed in 2002 and company stock went downward spiral
: and its survival was on the line. The stock dropped to $1.
: However, it was still a solid company with solid asset, pipeline and drugs
: to sell. Later, the stock bounced back to the high of $30 and was
: successfully sold.
: VRX is very similar to Elan in terms of product line and management behavior
: . The problem is it accumulated huge amount of debt ($30B) to finance the
: acquisition. When everything goes well, it is a wall street darling. However

avatar
a*1
6
做了那么多transaction,肯定会有猫腻的。
它的药一般不像有organic growth, 既然说有7%-15% organic growth,我就怀疑了。

情。

【在 c*******y 的大作中提到】
: 这事的时机不好,前有总统候选人,国会议员,WSJ,后来才是citron,
: 加上前俩月最近volatility这么大,大部分投资人不会在这么不确定的事情上浪费感情。
: 这放到去年,蒙混过去也说不定。
: VRX主要是诚信问题,那个100M买十年免费收购philidor的权利就很可疑。
: 都5.9%的revenue通过philidor了,不被捅出来,都不公布帐。
: Ackman早上做报告,辩论说这是这个industry的specialty pharmacy strategy,
: 不光VRX用,不了解这行,反正感觉水太深。。。
: 至于那几个影子药店,一样的电话号码,到底是不是做假账,真不好说。
: 至于citron上挖出,安然的ECO跟VRX CEO讲话如何一致,甚至CFO(?)的背景都是
: 长年麦肯锡,这就有点过了。

avatar
c*y
7
跟你说的一样,这是个upside和downside都很大的赌局,
winning ratio难以估计,如果50/50,就不值得了。

【在 a*****1 的大作中提到】
: 做了那么多transaction,肯定会有猫腻的。
: 它的药一般不像有organic growth, 既然说有7%-15% organic growth,我就怀疑了。
:
: 情。

avatar
a*1
8
说的对,每天看show还是entertaining的,自己进去赌肯定不行。

【在 c*******y 的大作中提到】
: 跟你说的一样,这是个upside和downside都很大的赌局,
: winning ratio难以估计,如果50/50,就不值得了。

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