《自然》子刊正调查“基因魔剪致突变”论文 - 未名空间MITBBS历史存档

国际科技财经博客移民网络热点娱乐民生时事公众号

Redian新闻

>未名空间

>Biology - 生物学

《自然》子刊正调查“基因魔剪致突变”论文

《自然》子刊正调查“基因魔剪致突变”论文# Biology - 生物学

M*y2017-07-26 07:07

1 楼

想问下大家，liu 律师服务怎么样？
从版上文章看，我的印象是他接case比较谨慎，那是不是意味着他的通过率很大？有没
有近100%啊？
我看他的premium service好像连推荐信都他们起草。效果可好？
他们通常准备起来快吗？一般要多久会准备好提交？
有没有可能出错？我看到有的人抱怨律师填表格有错误之类。

s*y2017-07-26 07:07

2 楼

5月底，国际期刊《自然·方法学》刊登了CRISPR-Cas9技术会导致小鼠体内数百个非目
标突变的文章。在引起人们对有“基因魔剪”之称的基因编辑技术CRISPR脱靶性担忧的
同时，这一论文也遭到生物界广泛的批评，认为该发表论文存在实验设计不科学、数据
不充分等问题。
当地时间7月25日，《自然·方法学》就该篇论文发表编辑部关注，“以提醒读者关于
其数据解读的担忧”。
“由于对照组小鼠和接受CRISPR/Cas9编辑的小鼠的背景基因多样性差异不明确，出现
以上结果的另一种可能是正常的遗传多样性。”《自然·方法学》在“编辑部关注”中
引用了驳斥这一论文科学性的一方观点。
“我们在与提出质疑的团体和论文作者保持联系，进一步调查此事。调查一结束，我们
便会通知读者。所有作者均不赞同本期刊发表编辑部关注的决定。”《自然·方法学》
表示。
该论文的作者来自美国哥伦比亚大学医学中心等机构，论文题目为《体内CRISPR-Cas9
编辑引发的不可预测基因突变》。基因编辑指的是人为地对基因进行剔除、插入、修复
。论文称，两只接受CRISPR-Cas9编辑的小鼠的全基因组序列中出现的单核苷酸变化，
是CRISPR编辑所造成的结果。
该论文在发表后引发了对基因编辑技术CRISPR安全性的担忧。但随即，两家基因编辑公
司Editas和Intellia Therapeutics的科学家们分别致信给期刊，认为这一论文的结论
错误，要求将该论文撤稿。哥伦比亚大学的这一论文发表后，Editas和Intellia
Therapeutics的股价大跌。
7月5日，美国哈佛大学、麻省总医院、麻省理工学院以及布罗德（Broad）研究所的7位
著名科学家联名在预印本网站bioRxiv发表文章，驳斥这一论文的科学性。驳斥文的作
者包括基因编辑领域的领先人物、哈佛大学教授乔治·丘吉尔。
http://www.popyard.com/cgi-mod/newspage.cgi?num=4212087&r=0&v=0&j=0

g*32017-07-26 07:07

3 楼

liu 不是接CASE谨慎，而是当他手头的CASE很多时，他的EVALUATION 的标准就出奇得
高。我曾让他评估过，他说 “After carefully reviewing your record, we
regret that our office is not able to .... due to ...... please consult
with other lawyers who may have a different opinion about the case.”
I then consulted with another lawyer and my case was approved without RFE.
Accepting only very strong cases does not mean he is a good immigration
lawyer but only mean the case is strong.没有听说过 “他的通过率很大“。
Go consult with other lawyers......

【在 M***y 的大作中提到】

: 想问下大家，liu 律师服务怎么样？
: 从版上文章看，我的印象是他接case比较谨慎，那是不是意味着他的通过率很大？有没
: 有近100%啊？
: 我看他的premium service好像连推荐信都他们起草。效果可好？
: 他们通常准备起来快吗？一般要多久会准备好提交？
: 有没有可能出错？我看到有的人抱怨律师填表格有错误之类。

Y*C2017-07-26 07:07

4 楼

church之类的都是自身有利益冲突的人，此文让他们损失惨重

a*d2017-07-26 07:07

5 楼

看得我心理平衡多了，我也被他拒绝了。

The citations and reviewer work are on the lower side of USCIS approved EB-
1A cases. The case will have a chance to be approved, but due to moderate
citations and reviewer work, we are not able to estimate the likelihood of
success. For this reason, we regret that we are not able to work on this EB-
1A case at this time. Please consult with other lawyers who may have a
different opinion about the case.

m*a2017-07-26 07:07

6 楼

科学还是讲究实事求是，利益冲突太正常了，谁不利益相关？在发表文章的时候明确指
出就行。

【在 Y**C 的大作中提到】

: church之类的都是自身有利益冲突的人，此文让他们损失惨重

c*g2017-07-26 07:07

7 楼

奇怪，为啥他生意那么好？

EB-

【在 a****d 的大作中提到】

: 看得我心理平衡多了，我也被他拒绝了。
:
: The citations and reviewer work are on the lower side of USCIS approved EB-
: 1A cases. The case will have a chance to be approved, but due to moderate
: citations and reviewer work, we are not able to estimate the likelihood of
: success. For this reason, we regret that we are not able to work on this EB-
: 1A case at this time. Please consult with other lawyers who may have a
: different opinion about the case.

N*e2017-07-26 07:07

8 楼

lmao
一群跳梁小丑

a*d2017-07-26 07:07

9 楼

人家名气大，生意肯定好。我们这种小弱case只有被惨无人道拒绝得份！

h*c2017-07-26 07:07

10 楼

这不废话吗，一个化学反应能准确到哪里？垃圾科研，自欺欺人。

x*w2017-07-26 07:07

11 楼

他们建议我申请NIW。
霍霍

P*R2017-07-26 07:07

12 楼

【在 s*********y 的大作中提到】

: 5月底，国际期刊《自然·方法学》刊登了CRISPR-Cas9技术会导致小鼠体内数百个非目
: 标突变的文章。在引起人们对有“基因魔剪”之称的基因编辑技术CRISPR脱靶性担忧的
: 同时，这一论文也遭到生物界广泛的批评，认为该发表论文存在实验设计不科学、数据
: 不充分等问题。
: 当地时间7月25日，《自然·方法学》就该篇论文发表编辑部关注，“以提醒读者关于
: 其数据解读的担忧”。
: “由于对照组小鼠和接受CRISPR/Cas9编辑的小鼠的背景基因多样性差异不明确，出现
: 以上结果的另一种可能是正常的遗传多样性。”《自然·方法学》在“编辑部关注”中
: 引用了驳斥这一论文科学性的一方观点。
: “我们在与提出质疑的团体和论文作者保持联系，进一步调查此事。调查一结束，我们

e*r2017-07-26 07:07

13 楼

很多硫痨不收的case也过了。。
不过我对伊印象不错，起码免费评估回信超快，而且在评估里指点了我一二。
非硫粉，我diy

【在 M***y 的大作中提到】

g*02017-07-26 07:07

14 楼

哈哈，就像老夫一年前的论断，伦理问题解决不了，某华裔明星科学家还想拿炸药奖简
直是做梦。

c*g2017-07-26 07:07

15 楼

大牛都是diy的

【在 e******r 的大作中提到】

: 很多硫痨不收的case也过了。。
: 不过我对伊印象不错，起码免费评估回信超快，而且在评估里指点了我一二。
: 非硫粉，我diy

Y*C2017-07-26 07:07

16 楼

他打死也轮不到的，论CRISPR原创性，他排不进前三。

【在 g********0 的大作中提到】

: 哈哈，就像老夫一年前的论断，伦理问题解决不了，某华裔明星科学家还想拿炸药奖简
: 直是做梦。

e*r2017-07-26 07:07

17 楼

可能那是对别人，我是弱case穷人diy尚无果。

【在 c******g 的大作中提到】

: 大牛都是diy的

g*02017-07-26 07:07

18 楼

所以他把宝押在真核系统第一人上，可惜炸药奖永远不会垂青投机分子。

【在 Y**C 的大作中提到】

: 他打死也轮不到的，论CRISPR原创性，他排不进前三。

b*r2017-07-26 07:07

19 楼

second this

【在 g*****3 的大作中提到】

: liu 不是接CASE谨慎，而是当他手头的CASE很多时，他的EVALUATION 的标准就出奇得
: 高。我曾让他评估过，他说 “After carefully reviewing your record, we
: regret that our office is not able to .... due to ...... please consult
: with other lawyers who may have a different opinion about the case.”
: I then consulted with another lawyer and my case was approved without RFE.
: Accepting only very strong cases does not mean he is a good immigration
: lawyer but only mean the case is strong.没有听说过 “他的通过率很大“。
: Go consult with other lawyers......

P*R2017-07-26 07:07

20 楼

重复出来了吗？

【在 Y**C 的大作中提到】

: church之类的都是自身有利益冲突的人，此文让他们损失惨重

M*y2017-07-26 07:07

21 楼

谢谢啊，我多问几家律师先。

a*d2017-07-26 07:07

22 楼

问了来share一下啊，我也在头疼，弱小case， NIW有等于无，eb1a实在是没有把握。
不知道找那个律师能有点帮助呢

e*d2017-07-26 07:07

23 楼

我当初也是被liu拒了，建议我还是走niw就好
不过拒我的不止他一个，事实上我问了一圈，除了一个律师别人都把我拒了= =

m*c2017-07-26 07:07

24 楼

frankly, liu is a good lawyer, but he will not boast your materials too much
. Therefore, if you background is not strong, please don't go. Your finally
application will be weaker than your background. For many background, he
will think that is not qualified to file.
I read one of my friend's application filed by liu law, I have to say it is
really terrible, and it is the worst application I read, even worse then DIY
without any EB1a knowledge.
I read many cases, including applications from 4 lawyers, many DIY
applications, and many RFEs and appeal letters.
I suggest you'd better DIY, or polish it based on DIY.
Laoda555 should be a good guy you should consider.

a*d2017-07-26 07:07

25 楼

Laoda555可以帮我们diy?

b*g2017-07-26 07:07

26 楼

Laoda555为啥不开移民公司呢?

p*82017-07-26 07:07

27 楼

re

much
finally
is
DIY

【在 m***c 的大作中提到】

: frankly, liu is a good lawyer, but he will not boast your materials too much
: . Therefore, if you background is not strong, please don't go. Your finally
: application will be weaker than your background. For many background, he
: will think that is not qualified to file.
: I read one of my friend's application filed by liu law, I have to say it is
: really terrible, and it is the worst application I read, even worse then DIY
: without any EB1a knowledge.
: I read many cases, including applications from 4 lawyers, many DIY
: applications, and many RFEs and appeal letters.
: I suggest you'd better DIY, or polish it based on DIY.

f*i2017-07-26 07:07

28 楼

我最近也找刘律师评估了一下，得到如下结论：
this EB-1A case should have a reasonable chance to be approved under normal
circumstances.
不知道各位大牛怎么看我这个Case得到批准的可能性，请大家多多指教

c*g2017-07-26 07:07

29 楼

你这个是show off 啊。刘律师给这个结论的都是大牛人

normal

【在 f****i 的大作中提到】

: 我最近也找刘律师评估了一下，得到如下结论：
: this EB-1A case should have a reasonable chance to be approved under normal
: circumstances.
: 不知道各位大牛怎么看我这个Case得到批准的可能性，请大家多多指教

a*d2017-07-26 07:07

30 楼

The citations and reviewer work are on the lower side of USCIS approved EB-
1A cases. The case will have a chance to be approved, but due to moderate
citations and reviewer work, we are not able to estimate the likelihood of
success
那Liu Law对我的case的结论如上，还有机会吗？

T*y2017-07-26 07:07

31 楼

Okay, here's the quantitative metric that Zac Liu used in his evaluation:
1. "Excellent chance" for those that the chance of approval is 90%~99%;
2. "Fairly good chance" for those that the chance of approval is 80%~89%.
3. "Reasonable chance" for those that the chance of approval is 60%~79%.
4. "Substantial risk" for those that the chance to be approved is below 60%.

T*y2017-07-26 07:07

32 楼

I should also add that other lawyers may refrain from giving any numerical
evaluations at all, since this number may be misleading, as a higher number
may make an applicant expect too much and a lower number may make him/her
lose confidence.
In reality, everybody has a chance, and give it your best try!

%.

【在 T*******y 的大作中提到】

: Okay, here's the quantitative metric that Zac Liu used in his evaluation:
: 1. "Excellent chance" for those that the chance of approval is 90%~99%;
: 2. "Fairly good chance" for those that the chance of approval is 80%~89%.
: 3. "Reasonable chance" for those that the chance of approval is 60%~79%.
: 4. "Substantial risk" for those that the chance to be approved is below 60%.

e*r2017-07-26 07:07

33 楼

甄古诗美女真乃兵器版‘百晓生’。。。

%.

【在 T*******y 的大作中提到】

T*y2017-07-26 07:07

34 楼

kaka,"甄古诗", very cool name! It used up dozens of my brain cells to figure this out. :-)
To back it up on what I said, those numbers were what Liu told me when I asked him what he meant exactly.

【在 e******r 的大作中提到】

: 甄古诗美女真乃兵器版‘百晓生’。。。
:
: %.

M*y2017-07-26 07:07

35 楼

cool. 我有level2的chance。可惜我还是决定先不申请了，我明年4月份还要申请F1延
期。:(

number

【在 T*******y 的大作中提到】

: I should also add that other lawyers may refrain from giving any numerical
: evaluations at all, since this number may be misleading, as a higher number
: may make an applicant expect too much and a lower number may make him/her
: lose confidence.
: In reality, everybody has a chance, and give it your best try!
:
: %.

T*y2017-07-26 07:07

36 楼

Have you got your documents almost ready? It often takes three months to get all the letters and print-outs ready. If you are ready now, you can probably get your green card or at least the EAD by next April, then you don't need to renew your OPT (if this is what you meant by F1) any more. If you are not on your OPT, but just purely F1, then probably you can wait till you work to apply for a green card, to be on the safe side.

延: 期。:(

【在 M***y 的大作中提到】

: cool. 我有level2的chance。可惜我还是决定先不申请了，我明年4月份还要申请F1延
: 期。:(
:
: number

n*12017-07-26 07:07

37 楼

其实我想问：他的case多不就表示他牛么。。。。
如果平白一个律师说我只接强case，谁买账啊

【在 g*****3 的大作中提到】

n*12017-07-26 07:07

38 楼

really terrible是什么意思？
为什么是worst application

much
finally
is
DIY

【在 m***c 的大作中提到】

M*y2017-07-26 07:07

39 楼

我要申请的是NIW,还要等排期的，所以估计到明年是拿不到EAD的吧？
我现在是pure F1,还没有opt，明年是想延长我的I-20上的那个时间。毕业估计在明年
底，到时候还要申请OPT。
我们学校ISSS这段时间刚好请了个律师过来讲移民，叫arthur serratelli,有没有人听
说过？他怎么样？据他说，I-20延期是绝对不会有问题，OPT申请，只要人在美国，也
不太会有问题。所以，我现在又开始想申请了。

get all the letters and print-outs ready. If you are ready now, you can
probably get your green card or at least the EAD by next April, then you don
't need to renew your OPT (if this is what you meant by F1) any more. If you
are not on your OPT, but just purely F1, then probably you can wait till
you work to apply for a green card, to be on the safe side.

【在 T*******y 的大作中提到】

: Have you got your documents almost ready? It often takes three months to get all the letters and print-outs ready. If you are ready now, you can probably get your green card or at least the EAD by next April, then you don't need to renew your OPT (if this is what you meant by F1) any more. If you are not on your OPT, but just purely F1, then probably you can wait till you work to apply for a green card, to be on the safe side.
:
: 延: 期。:(

T*y2017-07-26 07:07

40 楼

You are right, NIW needs to wait. What I talked about was for EB1.
年底，到时候还要申请OPT。我们学校ISSS这段时间刚好请了个律师过来讲移民，叫
arthur serratelli,有没有人听说过？他怎么样？据他说，I-20延期是绝对不会有问题
，OPT申请，只要人在美国，也不太会有问题。所以，我现在又开始想申请了。
I don't know the answer to this F1 or OPT question. Well, given current PD
of NIW, it might be quicker for you to get a green card if you apply for EB1
in 2013 than applying for NIW now. I could be wrong, though. If the EB2 PD
is greatly moved ahead after dealing with that 2007 batch, it could be fast
in the future.

【在 M***y 的大作中提到】

: 我要申请的是NIW,还要等排期的，所以估计到明年是拿不到EAD的吧？
: 我现在是pure F1,还没有opt，明年是想延长我的I-20上的那个时间。毕业估计在明年
: 底，到时候还要申请OPT。
: 我们学校ISSS这段时间刚好请了个律师过来讲移民，叫arthur serratelli,有没有人听
: 说过？他怎么样？据他说，I-20延期是绝对不会有问题，OPT申请，只要人在美国，也
: 不太会有问题。所以，我现在又开始想申请了。
:
: get all the letters and print-outs ready. If you are ready now, you can
: probably get your green card or at least the EAD by next April, then you don
: 't need to renew your OPT (if this is what you meant by F1) any more. If you

f*r2017-07-26 07:07

41 楼

I think I-20 extension is done within your university. OPT? I also think it
's not a big deal.

don
you

【在 M***y 的大作中提到】

a*d2017-07-26 07:07

42 楼

The case will have a chance to be approved, but due to moderate citations
and reviewer work, we are not able to estimate the likelihood of success.
For this reason, we regret that we are not able to work on this EB-1A case
at this time. Please consult with other lawyers who may have a different
opinion about the case。
楼上的，我和你的答复是一膜一样的。
总不能因为liu说了不行，我们自己就完全放弃了吧。

h*F2017-07-26 07:07

43 楼

From Liu Law:
The information given to me in your email indicates that you are eligible to
apply for a green card through national interest waiver (NIW Eb-2) and
through Eb-1A.
Good or not?

【在 a****d 的大作中提到】

: The case will have a chance to be approved, but due to moderate citations
: and reviewer work, we are not able to estimate the likelihood of success.
: For this reason, we regret that we are not able to work on this EB-1A case
: at this time. Please consult with other lawyers who may have a different
: opinion about the case。
: 楼上的，我和你的答复是一膜一样的。
: 总不能因为liu说了不行，我们自己就完全放弃了吧。

e*r2017-07-26 07:07

44 楼

about 60-79% success rate

to

【在 h********F 的大作中提到】

: From Liu Law:
: The information given to me in your email indicates that you are eligible to
: apply for a green card through national interest waiver (NIW Eb-2) and
: through Eb-1A.
: Good or not?

d*m2017-07-26 07:07

45 楼

我的是
“this EB-1A case will have a fair chance to be approved under normal
circumstances”
fair 和 resonable 的区别是什么？

%.

【在 T*******y 的大作中提到】

T*y2017-07-26 07:07

46 楼

I really don't know the differences between such subtle wordings. If you
really want to know what Liu meant, you could ask him. That's how I got his
explanations earlier.
In one way, the numerical evaluation and its associated wording may help
people gain a better understanding of their cases. However, in another way,
this evaluation really limits people's thinking.
Being 70% or 80% probable, does it make much difference in your case's
preparation or the final result? If Liu said risky, would you give it up? If
Liu said 90%, would you not to try your best to prepare for your case to
make it as best as it could be? For each one of us, the final result is
either a pass or not, and why bother with it's being 70% or 90%, perhaps
except ego satisfaction?
It's better not to focus on such numbers, but rather focus on how many
lawyers would like to take your case, and what they suggest you to do.
If many lawyers said yes, please consider DIY. I should have considered DIY,
although I don't regret using a lawyer.
If some lawyers said yes, but some said no, listen to their comments, and
try to find a way to support your case if you DIY. Or if you decide to use a
lawyer, make sure he is not a bad lawyer, and then trust him. Mutual
respect and open-hearted collaboration gives you the best result.
If no lawyers said yes, try to dig out more value of your case, and you can
possibly DIY. Don't give it up just yet. Or if they recommend you to do
something, be patient with yourself and finish up those tasks first. With
time and preparation, you can make a case.
Also remember that not all lawyers give out approval probabilities nor their
past success rates, as those do not make your case any more safer or
riskier. Each case is unique, as are you.

【在 d********m 的大作中提到】

: 我的是
: “this EB-1A case will have a fair chance to be approved under normal
: circumstances”
: fair 和 resonable 的区别是什么？
:
: %.

s*s2017-07-26 07:07

47 楼

他给俺的评论是： The brief information given to me in your message
indicates a very promising EB-1A case. 不在这4个标准之内啊！

%.

【在 T*******y 的大作中提到】

h*F2017-07-26 07:07

48 楼

楼上TrueStory白写那么多了，呵呵。

【在 s**********s 的大作中提到】

: 他给俺的评论是： The brief information given to me in your message
: indicates a very promising EB-1A case. 不在这4个标准之内啊！
:
: %.