S*e
2 楼
鬼类的
最好能给个链接
要完整地
谢谢
最好能给个链接
要完整地
谢谢
d*k
3 楼
俺基本上在用spring, web tier还是比较老的jsp+jstl。想试试用spring integrate
jsf， 牛人们能不能给点建议？另外，如果用了jsf, 这个spring mvc还能用吗？ 第一
个直觉是mvc还是基于action control, 而jsf的event control会不会是有冲突？谢谢
了！
jsf， 牛人们能不能给点建议？另外，如果用了jsf, 这个spring mvc还能用吗？ 第一
个直觉是mvc还是基于action control, 而jsf的event control会不会是有冲突？谢谢
了！
F*k
4 楼
mppmzx
e*6
5 楼
搬个板凳，同求。。。
g*g
6 楼
spring mvc和jsf属于竞争关系，不能混在一块用。
spring ioc, aop那些service layer的东西还是可以用的。
【在 d**k 的大作中提到】
: 俺基本上在用spring, web tier还是比较老的jsp+jstl。想试试用spring integrate
: jsf， 牛人们能不能给点建议？另外，如果用了jsf, 这个spring mvc还能用吗？ 第一
: 个直觉是mvc还是基于action control, 而jsf的event control会不会是有冲突？谢谢
: 了！
spring ioc, aop那些service layer的东西还是可以用的。
【在 d**k 的大作中提到】
: 俺基本上在用spring, web tier还是比较老的jsp+jstl。想试试用spring integrate
: jsf， 牛人们能不能给点建议？另外，如果用了jsf, 这个spring mvc还能用吗？ 第一
: 个直觉是mvc还是基于action control, 而jsf的event control会不会是有冲突？谢谢
: 了！
G*A
7 楼
这到底是啥意思?
【在 F*********k 的大作中提到】
: mppmzx
【在 F*********k 的大作中提到】
: mppmzx
d*k
9 楼
看来第一眼的印象还是对的。能给推荐一个spring+jsf 的example吗？
【在 g*****g 的大作中提到】
: spring mvc和jsf属于竞争关系，不能混在一块用。
: spring ioc, aop那些service layer的东西还是可以用的。
【在 g*****g 的大作中提到】
: spring mvc和jsf属于竞争关系，不能混在一块用。
: spring ioc, aop那些service layer的东西还是可以用的。
F*k
10 楼
没片片（照片）没真相
【在 G********A 的大作中提到】
: 这到底是啥意思?
【在 G********A 的大作中提到】
: 这到底是啥意思?
t*e
11 楼
Spring Web Flow, a continuations based work flow engine is the one you are
looking for.
looking for.
c*e
12 楼
网上找了个图片，是这样的吧？我们这里也有无数的这个东西，
看上去闻上去跟在国内吃过的野葱一样，可是就是没敢吃
看上去闻上去跟在国内吃过的野葱一样，可是就是没敢吃
g*g
13 楼
spring web flow sucks. Put tons of logic into XML is totally wrong.
I still prefer wicket for event-based framework.
【在 t*******e 的大作中提到】
: Spring Web Flow, a continuations based work flow engine is the one you are
: looking for.
I still prefer wicket for event-based framework.
【在 t*******e 的大作中提到】
: Spring Web Flow, a continuations based work flow engine is the one you are
: looking for.
b*y
14 楼
这个东西可讨厌了，拔之不尽长之不完。也不知道哪儿来的，怎么都除不尽。
【在 c*******e 的大作中提到】
: 网上找了个图片，是这样的吧？我们这里也有无数的这个东西，
: 看上去闻上去跟在国内吃过的野葱一样，可是就是没敢吃
【在 c*******e 的大作中提到】
: 网上找了个图片，是这样的吧？我们这里也有无数的这个东西，
: 看上去闻上去跟在国内吃过的野葱一样，可是就是没敢吃
t*e
15 楼
How often do we work on stateless applications? Practically, every
application boils down to business processes. XML like BPEL is a good
approach to express work flows. Page flow is not different from BPEL but
with a shorter life cycle.
【在 g*****g 的大作中提到】
: spring web flow sucks. Put tons of logic into XML is totally wrong.
: I still prefer wicket for event-based framework.
application boils down to business processes. XML like BPEL is a good
approach to express work flows. Page flow is not different from BPEL but
with a shorter life cycle.
【在 g*****g 的大作中提到】
: spring web flow sucks. Put tons of logic into XML is totally wrong.
: I still prefer wicket for event-based framework.
l*o
16 楼
恩， 这个我家院子也有不少。。。
g*g
17 楼
Web app is of course stateful. But I don't see the relationship
between XML and stateful.
I don't mind having configuration in XML, if you see a need to
change the configuration without recompliation, it's a valid
usage. However, when will you ever change configuration below
without changing java code, like never?
SWF will do
【在 t*******e 的大作中提到】
: How often do we work on stateless applications? Practically, every
: application boils down to business processes. XML like BPEL is a good
: approach to express work flows. Page flow is not different from BPEL but
: with a shorter life cycle.
between XML and stateful.
I don't mind having configuration in XML, if you see a need to
change the configuration without recompliation, it's a valid
usage. However, when will you ever change configuration below
without changing java code, like never?
SWF will do
【在 t*******e 的大作中提到】
: How often do we work on stateless applications? Practically, every
: application boils down to business processes. XML like BPEL is a good
: approach to express work flows. Page flow is not different from BPEL but
: with a shorter life cycle.
L*1
18 楼
叫野葱或小头蒜，总之能吃的。我用来包过饺子。绝对的纯天然为啥要讨厌他们哪？
t*e
19 楼
Selecting a web framework is nothing more than a personal preference. I
can claim that page navigation is part of configurations. Just think web
flow from a BPM perspective, a flow represents a business use case.
Isn't it nice to declare and program a use case/business process in the
same place? Instead of finding all navigation cases in different Java
classes, you get an integrated view for the entire use case. That is the
benefit we get from a BPM like approach.
【在 g*****g 的大作中提到】
: Web app is of course stateful. But I don't see the relationship
: between XML and stateful.
: I don't mind having configuration in XML, if you see a need to
: change the configuration without recompliation, it's a valid
: usage. However, when will you ever change configuration below
: without changing java code, like never?
: SWF will do
:
:
:
can claim that page navigation is part of configurations. Just think web
flow from a BPM perspective, a flow represents a business use case.
Isn't it nice to declare and program a use case/business process in the
same place? Instead of finding all navigation cases in different Java
classes, you get an integrated view for the entire use case. That is the
benefit we get from a BPM like approach.
【在 g*****g 的大作中提到】
: Web app is of course stateful. But I don't see the relationship
: between XML and stateful.
: I don't mind having configuration in XML, if you see a need to
: change the configuration without recompliation, it's a valid
: usage. However, when will you ever change configuration below
: without changing java code, like never?
: SWF will do
:
:
:
b*y
20 楼
长的地方不对，长在草地和花圃里了。
【在 L***1 的大作中提到】
: 叫野葱或小头蒜，总之能吃的。我用来包过饺子。绝对的纯天然为啥要讨厌他们哪？
【在 L***1 的大作中提到】
: 叫野葱或小头蒜，总之能吃的。我用来包过饺子。绝对的纯天然为啥要讨厌他们哪？
g*g
21 楼
Do you do that in Swing? You want to show a panel, what do you do?
You new the panel, and you call show funciton of it, plain and simple.
You don't declare the panel inside an XML, declare a state, then
associate that state with show function of the panel. Not that you
can't achieve XML navigation with Swing, but nobody does it for
a reason.
Once you put logic in XML that's beyond configuration, you lose the
benefits of what a strong type language can bring you in compilation
stage. A centric vi
【在 t*******e 的大作中提到】
: Selecting a web framework is nothing more than a personal preference. I
: can claim that page navigation is part of configurations. Just think web
: flow from a BPM perspective, a flow represents a business use case.
: Isn't it nice to declare and program a use case/business process in the
: same place? Instead of finding all navigation cases in different Java
: classes, you get an integrated view for the entire use case. That is the
: benefit we get from a BPM like approach.
You new the panel, and you call show funciton of it, plain and simple.
You don't declare the panel inside an XML, declare a state, then
associate that state with show function of the panel. Not that you
can't achieve XML navigation with Swing, but nobody does it for
a reason.
Once you put logic in XML that's beyond configuration, you lose the
benefits of what a strong type language can bring you in compilation
stage. A centric vi
【在 t*******e 的大作中提到】
: Selecting a web framework is nothing more than a personal preference. I
: can claim that page navigation is part of configurations. Just think web
: flow from a BPM perspective, a flow represents a business use case.
: Isn't it nice to declare and program a use case/business process in the
: same place? Instead of finding all navigation cases in different Java
: classes, you get an integrated view for the entire use case. That is the
: benefit we get from a BPM like approach.
m*o
22 楼
Enjoyed reading this discusstion. Wish to see more similar ones. Thanks
totempole and goodbug.
【在 g*****g 的大作中提到】
: Do you do that in Swing? You want to show a panel, what do you do?
: You new the panel, and you call show funciton of it, plain and simple.
: You don't declare the panel inside an XML, declare a state, then
: associate that state with show function of the panel. Not that you
: can't achieve XML navigation with Swing, but nobody does it for
: a reason.
: Once you put logic in XML that's beyond configuration, you lose the
: benefits of what a strong type language can bring you in compilation
: stage. A centric vi
totempole and goodbug.
【在 g*****g 的大作中提到】
: Do you do that in Swing? You want to show a panel, what do you do?
: You new the panel, and you call show funciton of it, plain and simple.
: You don't declare the panel inside an XML, declare a state, then
: associate that state with show function of the panel. Not that you
: can't achieve XML navigation with Swing, but nobody does it for
: a reason.
: Once you put logic in XML that's beyond configuration, you lose the
: benefits of what a strong type language can bring you in compilation
: stage. A centric vi
t*e
23 楼
We ran into the same discussion had sometime ago. The topic was JavaFX,
where GUI is declared through a declarative language. Anyway, annotation
is not a replacement of XML. For relatively static settings tied
to specific Java classes, methods, properties, I would use source-level
annotations. I prefer to use XML for more volatile, global settings not
tied to Java source code to avoid recompilation on changes. There are no
substantial differences between BPM and Spring Web Flow, essentially
busi
【在 g*****g 的大作中提到】
: Do you do that in Swing? You want to show a panel, what do you do?
: You new the panel, and you call show funciton of it, plain and simple.
: You don't declare the panel inside an XML, declare a state, then
: associate that state with show function of the panel. Not that you
: can't achieve XML navigation with Swing, but nobody does it for
: a reason.
: Once you put logic in XML that's beyond configuration, you lose the
: benefits of what a strong type language can bring you in compilation
: stage. A centric vi
where GUI is declared through a declarative language. Anyway, annotation
is not a replacement of XML. For relatively static settings tied
to specific Java classes, methods, properties, I would use source-level
annotations. I prefer to use XML for more volatile, global settings not
tied to Java source code to avoid recompilation on changes. There are no
substantial differences between BPM and Spring Web Flow, essentially
busi
【在 g*****g 的大作中提到】
: Do you do that in Swing? You want to show a panel, what do you do?
: You new the panel, and you call show funciton of it, plain and simple.
: You don't declare the panel inside an XML, declare a state, then
: associate that state with show function of the panel. Not that you
: can't achieve XML navigation with Swing, but nobody does it for
: a reason.
: Once you put logic in XML that's beyond configuration, you lose the
: benefits of what a strong type language can bring you in compilation
: stage. A centric vi
t*e
24 楼
Yeah, we had several debates in a row last year.
【在 m******o 的大作中提到】
: Enjoyed reading this discusstion. Wish to see more similar ones. Thanks
: totempole and goodbug.
【在 m******o 的大作中提到】
: Enjoyed reading this discusstion. Wish to see more similar ones. Thanks
: totempole and goodbug.
k*u
25 楼
To me, the page based web technologies, be it jsp or jsf, are all outdated.
The future of the web is something like GWT and Flex, Flex is more mature
than GWT, but GWT shines in the language it's based on - Java!
The future of the web is something like GWT and Flex, Flex is more mature
than GWT, but GWT shines in the language it's based on - Java!
m*o
26 楼
Have not done anything but reading GWT stuff. I have to say that I
completely agree with you on this. I will begin to play with it and
seriously recommend it to every java developer (who happens to be here and
reads this :o)
.
【在 k****u 的大作中提到】
: To me, the page based web technologies, be it jsp or jsf, are all outdated.
: The future of the web is something like GWT and Flex, Flex is more mature
: than GWT, but GWT shines in the language it's based on - Java!
completely agree with you on this. I will begin to play with it and
seriously recommend it to every java developer (who happens to be here and
reads this :o)
.
【在 k****u 的大作中提到】
: To me, the page based web technologies, be it jsp or jsf, are all outdated.
: The future of the web is something like GWT and Flex, Flex is more mature
: than GWT, but GWT shines in the language it's based on - Java!
o*1
27 楼
RIA 还有很多吧
ZK, Vaadin, click 等等的
选择忒多了也是麻烦
outdated
mature
【在 m******o 的大作中提到】
: Have not done anything but reading GWT stuff. I have to say that I
: completely agree with you on this. I will begin to play with it and
: seriously recommend it to every java developer (who happens to be here and
: reads this :o)
:
: .
ZK, Vaadin, click 等等的
选择忒多了也是麻烦
outdated
mature
【在 m******o 的大作中提到】
: Have not done anything but reading GWT stuff. I have to say that I
: completely agree with you on this. I will begin to play with it and
: seriously recommend it to every java developer (who happens to be here and
: reads this :o)
:
: .
m*o
28 楼
I am totally uninformed of the ones you mentioned :o( . I was thinking about:
1. The power of Google and their (and Microsoft's) push for the web based
application.
2. I'm guessing most java developers would love to leave JavaScript behind
them if they can (based upon my own feelings, though). I also feel that GWT
looks and feels a lot more 'familiar' to a typical java developer than
JavaScript does.
3. The default Ajax performance with GWT.
I probably should study more on this, I think. I might
【在 o**1 的大作中提到】
: RIA 还有很多吧
: ZK, Vaadin, click 等等的
: 选择忒多了也是麻烦
:
: outdated
: mature
1. The power of Google and their (and Microsoft's) push for the web based
application.
2. I'm guessing most java developers would love to leave JavaScript behind
them if they can (based upon my own feelings, though). I also feel that GWT
looks and feels a lot more 'familiar' to a typical java developer than
JavaScript does.
3. The default Ajax performance with GWT.
I probably should study more on this, I think. I might
【在 o**1 的大作中提到】
: RIA 还有很多吧
: ZK, Vaadin, click 等等的
: 选择忒多了也是麻烦
:
: outdated
: mature
o*1
29 楼
GWT 是 component based的吗？
user interface怎么开发？有visual editor吗？
about:
GWT
【在 m******o 的大作中提到】
: I am totally uninformed of the ones you mentioned :o( . I was thinking about:
: 1. The power of Google and their (and Microsoft's) push for the web based
: application.
: 2. I'm guessing most java developers would love to leave JavaScript behind
: them if they can (based upon my own feelings, though). I also feel that GWT
: looks and feels a lot more 'familiar' to a typical java developer than
: JavaScript does.
: 3. The default Ajax performance with GWT.
: I probably should study more on this, I think. I might
user interface怎么开发？有visual editor吗？
about:
GWT
【在 m******o 的大作中提到】
: I am totally uninformed of the ones you mentioned :o( . I was thinking about:
: 1. The power of Google and their (and Microsoft's) push for the web based
: application.
: 2. I'm guessing most java developers would love to leave JavaScript behind
: them if they can (based upon my own feelings, though). I also feel that GWT
: looks and feels a lot more 'familiar' to a typical java developer than
: JavaScript does.
: 3. The default Ajax performance with GWT.
: I probably should study more on this, I think. I might
k*u
30 楼
GWT is component based, pretty much like Swing. There are some 3rd party
visual editor, you can google for it. However, GWT just released 2.0 with
the new declarative UI (code UI in xml, behavior in Java), which is a major
change, so the editors will take a while to catch up for that.
【在 o**1 的大作中提到】
: GWT 是 component based的吗？
: user interface怎么开发？有visual editor吗？
:
: about:
: GWT
visual editor, you can google for it. However, GWT just released 2.0 with
the new declarative UI (code UI in xml, behavior in Java), which is a major
change, so the editors will take a while to catch up for that.
【在 o**1 的大作中提到】
: GWT 是 component based的吗？
: user interface怎么开发？有visual editor吗？
:
: about:
: GWT
t*e
31 楼
Interesting! GWT finally took the same approach as many other web
technologies. Back to the long thread of discussion we had last year, it
seems I was spot-on with regard to the shortcomings of GWT. In short,
declarative language is more appropriate than OO programming language in
terms of UI design.
with
major
【在 k****u 的大作中提到】
: GWT is component based, pretty much like Swing. There are some 3rd party
: visual editor, you can google for it. However, GWT just released 2.0 with
: the new declarative UI (code UI in xml, behavior in Java), which is a major
: change, so the editors will take a while to catch up for that.
technologies. Back to the long thread of discussion we had last year, it
seems I was spot-on with regard to the shortcomings of GWT. In short,
declarative language is more appropriate than OO programming language in
terms of UI design.
with
major
【在 k****u 的大作中提到】
: GWT is component based, pretty much like Swing. There are some 3rd party
: visual editor, you can google for it. However, GWT just released 2.0 with
: the new declarative UI (code UI in xml, behavior in Java), which is a major
: change, so the editors will take a while to catch up for that.
k*u
32 楼
To be more precise, declarative languages like XML/HTML is the best choice
for UI layout, as how people used to design/layout HTML pages. But there
still needs to be some bindings from XML elements to Java UI components so
that we can add UI logic, event handling, remoting, etc to the UI components
. That's exactly how Flex programming model works (MXML for layout and
ActionScript3 for programming components) and GWT obviously is going under
the same route.
【在 t*******e 的大作中提到】
: Interesting! GWT finally took the same approach as many other web
: technologies. Back to the long thread of discussion we had last year, it
: seems I was spot-on with regard to the shortcomings of GWT. In short,
: declarative language is more appropriate than OO programming language in
: terms of UI design.
:
: with
: major
for UI layout, as how people used to design/layout HTML pages. But there
still needs to be some bindings from XML elements to Java UI components so
that we can add UI logic, event handling, remoting, etc to the UI components
. That's exactly how Flex programming model works (MXML for layout and
ActionScript3 for programming components) and GWT obviously is going under
the same route.
【在 t*******e 的大作中提到】
: Interesting! GWT finally took the same approach as many other web
: technologies. Back to the long thread of discussion we had last year, it
: seems I was spot-on with regard to the shortcomings of GWT. In short,
: declarative language is more appropriate than OO programming language in
: terms of UI design.
:
: with
: major
m*t
33 楼
I have a side project that uses flex. The declarative stuff was nice in the
beginning, but soon it became restrictive because I was trying to add some
highly dynamic logic.
I'm working on a project using gwt now, and for that reason I'm not really
very thrilled by the new xml UI in 2.0.
components
【在 k****u 的大作中提到】
: To be more precise, declarative languages like XML/HTML is the best choice
: for UI layout, as how people used to design/layout HTML pages. But there
: still needs to be some bindings from XML elements to Java UI components so
: that we can add UI logic, event handling, remoting, etc to the UI components
: . That's exactly how Flex programming model works (MXML for layout and
: ActionScript3 for programming components) and GWT obviously is going under
: the same route.
beginning, but soon it became restrictive because I was trying to add some
highly dynamic logic.
I'm working on a project using gwt now, and for that reason I'm not really
very thrilled by the new xml UI in 2.0.
components
【在 k****u 的大作中提到】
: To be more precise, declarative languages like XML/HTML is the best choice
: for UI layout, as how people used to design/layout HTML pages. But there
: still needs to be some bindings from XML elements to Java UI components so
: that we can add UI logic, event handling, remoting, etc to the UI components
: . That's exactly how Flex programming model works (MXML for layout and
: ActionScript3 for programming components) and GWT obviously is going under
: the same route.
s*e
34 楼
It seems this is another thread about convention-based we framework vs
configuration-based web framework. This has bee debated for long time. I do
not think it will end soon.
About SWF, I had a chance to listen and discuss with the guy who found it
some time ago. Well I know that I should not judge a project based on one
single talk. But I wasn't impressed and will stay away from it.
About Flex, I have been using it for more than 1.5 years, the ui looks cool
if you code well, but it really remin
configuration-based web framework. This has bee debated for long time. I do
not think it will end soon.
About SWF, I had a chance to listen and discuss with the guy who found it
some time ago. Well I know that I should not judge a project based on one
single talk. But I wasn't impressed and will stay away from it.
About Flex, I have been using it for more than 1.5 years, the ui looks cool
if you code well, but it really remin
t*e
35 楼
The nature of Spring Web Flow is continuations and work flow engine. Seam
page flow built on the same concepts can declare page flows through
annotations or programming APIs, XML is not mandatory. Being an XML
hater, one can still enjoy the new web approach without touching XML.
Likewise, it is not difficult to dig into Spring Web Flow native APIs to
manipulate navigations in Java code, while the code will be less POJO.
Since XML has been the only piece you noticed, the nature of the
technology
【在 s******e 的大作中提到】
: It seems this is another thread about convention-based we framework vs
: configuration-based web framework. This has bee debated for long time. I do
: not think it will end soon.
: About SWF, I had a chance to listen and discuss with the guy who found it
: some time ago. Well I know that I should not judge a project based on one
: single talk. But I wasn't impressed and will stay away from it.
: About Flex, I have been using it for more than 1.5 years, the ui looks cool
: if you code well, but it really remin
page flow built on the same concepts can declare page flows through
annotations or programming APIs, XML is not mandatory. Being an XML
hater, one can still enjoy the new web approach without touching XML.
Likewise, it is not difficult to dig into Spring Web Flow native APIs to
manipulate navigations in Java code, while the code will be less POJO.
Since XML has been the only piece you noticed, the nature of the
technology
【在 s******e 的大作中提到】
: It seems this is another thread about convention-based we framework vs
: configuration-based web framework. This has bee debated for long time. I do
: not think it will end soon.
: About SWF, I had a chance to listen and discuss with the guy who found it
: some time ago. Well I know that I should not judge a project based on one
: single talk. But I wasn't impressed and will stay away from it.
: About Flex, I have been using it for more than 1.5 years, the ui looks cool
: if you code well, but it really remin
s*e
36 楼
Well, I never said that I was a html hater, actually i am pretty much
enjoying using struts and old SpringMVC. But I am really not impressed with
SFW. especially after talking to the guy who found it.
enjoying using struts and old SpringMVC. But I am really not impressed with
SFW. especially after talking to the guy who found it.
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