TED｜美国种族问题：我们需要谈谈不公正！

你在这里说的话可以影响整个世界。 透过TED传送的讯息，它的重要性和力量大于别的传播平台。

And I mention that because I think identity is really important. And we've had some fantastic presentations. And I think what we've learned is that, if you're a teacher, your words can be meaningful, but if you're a compassionate teacher, they can be especially meaningful. 

提到这个，是因为我认为自我定位是非常重要的。我们已经听过一些十分美妙的演讲，我想我们已经了解，如果你是老师，你说的话会变得有影响力；但如果你是一个富有同情心的老师，你的话会更别具意义意。

If you're a doctor, you can do some good things, but if you're a caring doctor, you can do some other things. So I want to talk about the power of identity. And I didn't learn about this actually practicing law and doing the work that I do. I actually learned about this from my grandmother.

如果你是医生，你可以做些好事；但如果你是有爱心的医生，你可以做的更多。所以我要谈关于自我定位的力量。其实我不是在工作中学习到这些的。实际上，我是从我外婆身上学到的。

I grew up in a house that was the traditional African American home that was dominated by a matriarch, and that matriarch was my grandmother. She was tough, she was strong, she was powerful. She was the end of every argument in our family. 

我在一个传统的非裔美国家庭中长大，我的外婆掌管家中大小事。她既强悍又硬朗，很有权威。家中所有纷争都由她收尾，做最终定夺。

She was the beginning of a lot of arguments in our family. She was the daughter of people who were actually enslaved. Her parents were born in slavery in Virginia in the 1840s. She was born in the 1880s, and the experience of slavery very much shaped the way she saw the world.

同样的，家中很多的争吵也是她起的头。她是奴隶的女儿。她的父母在1840年代出生于维吉尼亚洲，生下来就是奴隶。她出生1880年代，过去身为奴隶的经历构成她看待世界的方式。

And my grandmother was tough, but she was also loving. When I would see her as a little boy, she'd come up to me and give me these hugs. And she'd squeeze me so tight I could barely breathe, and then she'd let me go. And an hour or two later, if I saw her, she'd come over to me and say, "Bryan, do you still feel me hugging you?" If I said, "No," she'd assault me again, and if I said, "Yes," she'd leave me alone. And she just had this quality that you always wanted to be near her. And the only challenge was that she had 10 children. My mom was the youngest of her 10 kids. And sometimes when I would go and spend time with her, it would be difficult to get her time and attention. My cousins would be running around everywhere.

我外婆虽然强悍，但她也很慈爱。当我小的时候，她见到我时，总是过来拥抱我。她紧紧抱住我，几乎到了无法呼吸的地步，然后才放开我一两个小时后，外婆看到我， 会问我：「Bryan，你仍然感受得到我的拥抱吗？」如果我回答「没有」，她会再次进攻，如果我说「有」，她就不再打扰我。她有一种 让人想亲近她的特质。唯一的困扰是她有十个小孩，我妈妈是当中最年幼的。 有时候我想要花时间和她相处，很难得她的时间和注意力。 我的表兄弟姊妹们总是在围绕在四周。

And I remember, when I was about eight or nine years old, waking up one morning, going into the living room, and all of my cousins were running around. And my grandmother was sitting across the room, staring at me. And at first, I thought we were playing a game. And I would look at her, and I'd smile, but she was very serious. And after about 15 or 20 minutes of this, she got up and she came across the room, and she took me by the hand, and she said, "Come on, Bryan. You and I are going to have a talk." And I remember this just like it happened yesterday. I never will forget it.

我记得，当我大概八或九岁的时候，有天早上醒来，走进客厅， 我所有的表兄弟姊妹都在。我外婆坐在客厅的另外一边盯着我看。一开始我以为我们在玩游戏。 我笑着回看她， 但她非常严肃。 大约15或20分钟之后，她起身走过客厅，牵起我的手， 她说：「来吧，Bryan。我们需要谈一下。」 这彷彿是昨天才发生过的事。 我永远不会忘记。

She took me out back and said, "Bryan, I'm going to tell you something, but you don't tell anybody what I tell you." I said, "OK, Mama." She said, "Now, you make sure you don't do that." I said, "Sure." Then she sat me down and she looked at me, and she said, "I want you to know I've been watching you." And she said, "I think you're special." She said, "I think you can do anything you want to do." I will never forget it.

她带我到外面，跟我说：「Bryan，我要跟你说一些事，但你不可以跟任何人说。」 我说，「好的，嬷嬷。」 她说：「你保证你不跟别人说。」我说：「当然。」 然后她要我坐下，看着我， 她说：「我要你知道， 我一直都在注意你。」 「我觉得你很特别。」 「我认为你可以做到任何你想要做的事。」 我永远忘不了这一幕。

And then she said, "I just need you to promise me three things, Bryan." I said, "OK, Mama." She said, "The first thing I want you to promise me is that you'll always love your mom." She said, "That's my baby girl, and you have to promise me now you'll always take care of her." Well, I adored my mom, so I said, "Yes, Mama. I'll do that." Then she said, "The second thing I want you to promise me is that you'll always do the right thing, even when the right thing is the hard thing." And I thought about it, and I said, "Yes, Mama. I'll do that." Then finally, she said, "The third thing I want you to promise me is that you'll never drink alcohol." Well, I was nine years old, so I said, "Yes, Mama. I'll do that."

接着她说：「我要你答应我三件事情，Bryan。」我说：「没问题，嬷嬷。」她说：「第一，我要你答应我 你会永远爱你的母亲。」她说：「她是我的宝贝女儿， 你要答应我，你会永远照顾她。」我非常爱我妈妈，于是我说：「好的，嬷嬷。」接着她说：「第二，我要你答应我，你永远都要做正确的事，即使有时候，正确的事是相对困难的事。」我想了一下，回答：「好的，嬷嬷。我会照做。」最后她说：「第三件事，我要你保证， 你永远不喝酒。」我当时才九岁，所以我说：「好的，嬷嬷。我答应妳。」

I grew up in the country in the rural South, and I have a brother a year older than me and a sister a year younger. When I was about 14 or 15, one day, my brother came home and he had this six-pack of beer; I don't know where he got it. He grabbed me and my sister, and we went out in the woods, and we were just out there doing the stuff we crazily did, and he had a sip of this beer and gave some to my sister and she had some, and they offered it to me.

我在南方的乡村中长大，我有一个大一岁的哥哥和一个小一岁的妹妹。当我大概14或15岁的时候，有一天我哥哥带了半打啤酒回家，我不知道他从哪里弄来的。然后，他带着我和我妹妹到树林中，我们在那里疯狂玩乐嬉闹，我哥哥喝了一口啤酒，接着交给我妹妹，她跟着喝了一些，然后他们将酒递给我。 

I said, "No, that's OK. Y'all go ahead. I'm not going to have any." My brother said, "Come on. We're doing this today; you always do what we do. I had some, your sister had some. Have some beer." I said, "No, I don't feel right about that. Y'all go ahead." And then my brother stared at me and said, "What's wrong with you? Have some beer." Then he looked at me real hard and said, "Oh, I hope you're not still hung up on that conversation Mama had with you."

我说：「不用了，你们喝就好，我不喝啤酒。」我哥哥说：「试试看，今天我们就是要一起尝试这件事，我喝了，妹妹也喝了，你也喝一些吧。」我说：「不要，我觉得这样不好。你们喝吧。」我哥哥盯着我看，他说：「你哪根筋不对劲？喝点啤酒吧。」接着他怀疑地看着我，他说，「噢，我希望你不是还在为了嬷嬷跟你说的话烦恼。」

I said, "What are you talking about?" He said, "Oh, Mama tells all the grandkids that they're special."I was devastated. And I'm going to admit something to you. I'm going to tell you something I probably shouldn't. I know this might be broadcast broadly. But I'm 52 years old, and I'm going to admit to you that I've never had a drop of alcohol.

我说：「你在说什么？」哥哥说：「喔，嬷嬷告诉所有孙子他们很特别。」 我当时心碎了。但我要跟你们承认一件事。这件事我也许不该说出来。我知道这个演说是会散播出去的。 我现在52岁了， 而且我要承认我从来没有沾过一滴酒精。

I don't say that because I think that's virtuous; I say that because there is power in identity. When we create the right kind of identity, we can say things to the world around us that they don't actually believe make sense. We can get them to do things that they don't think they can do. When I thought about my grandmother, of course she would think all her grandkids were special. My grandfather was in prison during prohibition. My male uncles died of alcohol-related diseases. And these were the things she thought we needed to commit to.

我说这个不是因为我认为这是有品德的事；我说这个是因为自我定位是有力量的。当有了正确的自我定位，我们可以让周遭的人更轻易被说服。我们能激励他们做些他们不认为自己可以做的事。当我想到我的外婆，她当然会认为她所有的孙子都很特别。在美国的禁酒时期，我外公被关在监狱里。我的几个舅舅死于酒精相关的疾病。所以这是外婆要我们承诺她的理由。

Well, I've been trying to say something about our criminal justice system. This country is very different today than it was 40 years ago. In 1972, there were 300,000 people in jails and prisons. Today, there are 2.3 million. The United States now has the highest rate of incarceration in the world. We have seven million people on probation and parole. And mass incarceration, in my judgment, has fundamentally changed our world. In poor communities, in communities of color, there is this despair, there is this hopelessness that is being shaped by these outcomes. One out of three Black men between the ages of 18 and 30 is in jail, in prison, on probation or parole. In urban communities across this country -- Los Angeles, Philadelphia, Baltimore, Washington -- 50 to 60 percent of all young men of color are in jail or prison or on probation or parole.

我开始来聊一些，关于美国的犯罪司法系统。我们的国家和40年前相比有非常大的不同。在1972年，有三十万人被关在拘留所或监狱中。现在，人数已经高达两百三十万人。美国有全世界最高比例的服刑人口。我们有七百万人在缓刑和假释中。我认为，大量的判刑，彻底改变了我们的世界。在贫困的社区里，有色人种的社区里，充满了绝望。对未来不抱希望。这就是现今制度产生的一些后果。18岁到30岁的黑人男子，有三分之一在拘留所、监狱里，缓刑或假释中。 美国的大城市洛杉矶，宾州，巴尔地摩，华盛顿百分之五十到六十的年轻有色人种在拘留所、监狱里，缓刑或假释中。

Our system isn't just being shaped in these ways that seem to be distorting around race, they're also distorted by poverty. We have a system of justice in this country that treats you much better if you're rich and guilty than if you're poor and innocent. Wealth, not culpability, shapes outcomes. And yet, we seem to be very comfortable. The politics of fear and anger have made us believe that these are problems that are not our problems. We've been disconnected.

我国的法制系统不仅是被种族问题扭曲了，似乎也被贫穷所扭曲了。在这个国家，我们的司法系统对待富有的犯罪者比贫穷但清白的人还好。财富决定结果，而不是有罪与否。然而，一般民众似乎还蛮习惯的。恐惧和愤怒的政治操作让我们相信这些问题不是我们的问题。我们已经脱节了。

It's interesting to me. We're looking at some very interesting developments in our work. My state of Alabama, like a number of states, actually permanently disenfranchises you if you have a criminal conviction. Right now in Alabama, 34 percent of the Black male population has permanently lost the right to vote. We're actually projecting that in another 10 years, the level of disenfranchisement will be as high as it's been since prior to the passage of the Voting Rights Act. And there is this stunning silence.

引起我注意的是，我在工作中看到些非常有趣的发展。我所居住的阿拉巴马州，如同很多其它州一般，如果你曾经犯罪过，你的公民权利会被永远剥夺。现在在阿拉巴马州，百分之三十四的黑人男性人口数已经永远失去投票权。我们推断，再过十年后，被剥夺公民权的人数比例将和通过选举权法之前不分上下。 这事实令人震惊。

I represent children. A lot of my clients are very young. The United States is the only country in the world where we sentence 13-year-old children to die in prison. We have life imprisonment without parole for kids in this country. And we're actually doing some litigation. The only country in the world.

我很多客户都非常年轻，有时我会成为一些孩子的委任律师。美国是世界上唯一一个国家会将13岁的小孩判死刑。这也是世界上唯一一个国家会判小孩终身监禁，不得保释。实际上，我们仍然在为这些案子奋斗，进行诉讼。

I represent people on death row. It's interesting, this question of the death penalty. In many ways, we've been taught to think that the real question is: Do people deserve to die for the crimes they've committed? And that's a very sensible question. But there's another way of thinking about where we are in our identity. The other way of thinking about it is not: Do people deserve to die for the crimes they commit?, but: Do we deserve to kill? I mean, it's fascinating.

我也会为死刑犯辩护。死刑这个问题很有趣。在很多方面，我们被引导朝向人们是否应该为他们所犯的罪而死？这个问题去思考。这是个非常合理的问题。但有另外一种思考的方式，这有关我们本身的定位。另一种思考的方式，不是人们是否应该为他们所犯的罪而死，而是我们是否有权利去结束别人的生命？我的意思是，这很值得玩味。

Death penalty in America is defined by error. For every nine people who have been executed, we've actually identified one innocent person who's been exonerated and released from death row. A kind of astonishing error rate -- one out of nine people, innocent. I mean, it's fascinating. In aviation, we would never let people fly on airplanes if, for every nine planes that took off, one would crash. But somehow, we can insulate ourselves from this problem. It's not our problem. It's not our burden. It's not our struggle.

在美国，死刑会被错判。每九个被判死刑的人之中，就有一个是无辜的，事后会被证明无罪，然后释放。多人震惊的失误率，九个死刑犯中，就有一个是清白的。 这真的难以置信。以飞行来比喻，如果每九架起飞的飞机中，就有一架会坠机， 我们绝对不会让人们开飞机。 但不知道为什么，我们却无视这个问题。 这不是我们自身的问题。这不是我们自身的责任。这不是我们该努力争取的。

I talk a lot about these issues. I talk about race and this question of whether we deserve to kill. And it's interesting, when I teach my students about African American history, I tell them about slavery. I tell them about terrorism, the era that began at the end of reconstruction that went on to World War II. We don't really know very much about it. But for African Americans in this country, that was an era defined by terror.

我谈过很多相关的议题。我讲到种族，还有我们是否有权利结束别人的生命这个问题。有趣的是，当我教我的学生非裔美国人的历史时，我告诉他们有关奴隶制度，有关恐怖主义，开始于南北战争结束后，接着第二次世界大战爆发。其实我们不是真的非常了解这些。但对这个国家中的非裔美国人，那是个充满恐惧的年代。

In many communities, people had to worry about being lynched. They had to worry about being bombed. It was the threat of terror that shaped their lives. And these older people come up to me now and say, "Mr. Stevenson, you give talks, you make speeches, you tell people to stop saying we're dealing with terrorism for the first time in our nation's history after 9/11." They tell me to say, "No, tell them that we grew up with that." And that era of terrorism, of course, was followed by segregation and decades of racial subordination and apartheid.

在很多社区，人们担心被处私刑，担心被武器攻击。这种恐怖威胁就一直存在是他们的生活。现在这些老年人见到我，他们说：「Steven先生，你四处演讲，你告诉人们，不要再说在美国历史中，九一一是我们第一次遭遇恐怖攻击。」他们说：「告诉听众，我们从小就在恐怖威胁中长大。」 当然，这种恐怖行动， 造成了种族间的鸿沟，于是有了长达几十年的种族歧视，和种族隔离政策。

And yet, we have in this country this dynamic where we really don't like to talk about our problems. We don't like to talk about our history. And because of that, we really haven't understood what it's meant to do the things we've done historically. We're constantly running into each other. We're constantly creating tensions and conflicts. We have a hard time talking about race, and I believe it's because we are unwilling to commit ourselves to a process of truth and reconciliation. In South Africa, people understood that we couldn't overcome apartheid without a commitment to truth and reconciliation. In Rwanda, even after the genocide, there was this commitment. But in this country, we haven't done that.

然而，在这个国家里，我们有个默契，不讨论我们的问题；我们不谈论我们的历史。正因如此，我们不真的理解这些历史事件的真正意义。我们持续地互相产生冲突。我们不停地制造紧张情况和斗争。我们不能好好地谈论种族，因为我们不愿意立下承诺要面对事实和进行和解。在南非，人们了解没有下定决心要了解事实和进行和解的话，没有办法战胜种族隔离政策。在卢安达即使发生了大屠杀，事后也有这种彼此的和解和承诺。但在美国，我们不曾这样做过。

I was giving some lectures in Germany about the death penalty. It was fascinating, because one of the scholars stood up after the presentation and said, "Well, you know, it's deeply troubling to hear what you're talking about." He said, "We don't have the death penalty in Germany, and of course, we can never have the death penalty in Germany." And the room got very quiet, and this woman said, "There's no way, with our history, we could ever engage in the systematic killing of human beings. It would be unconscionable for us to, in an intentional and deliberate way, set about executing people." And I thought about that. What would it feel like to be living in a world where the nation-state of Germany was executing people, especially if they were disproportionately Jewish? I couldn't bear it. It would be unconscionable.

我在德国做过一些有关死刑的演讲。有趣的是，演说结束后，有位学者站起来，她说：「你的演讲，内容很令人痛心。」她接着说：「在德国，我们没有死刑。 我们也永远不可能有死刑。」然后整个房间变得非常安静，这位女士接着说：「我们从历史得到的教训，让我们绝对不可能有系统地杀人。有目的且蓄意地处决人类，这是我们良心上所不允许的。」我思考这个问题，如果生活在会执行死刑的德国，特别是任意处死犹太人，到底是怎样的感觉。这个想法令我觉得难受。这是不合理的。

And yet, in this country, in the states of the Old South, we execute people -- where you're 11 times more likely to get the death penalty if the victim is white than if the victim is Black, 22 times more likely to get it if the defendant is Black and the victim is white -- in the very states where there are, buried in the ground, the bodies of people who were lynched. And yet, there is this disconnect.

然而，在这个国家，在南方各州，我们仍在执行死刑。刑事案件中，当受害者是白人，被告被判死刑的机率比受害者是黑人时，高了11倍。如果被告正好是黑人，受害者是白人，那被判死刑的机率高达22倍。就在这些州里，土地里埋着被受私刑而死的人们。然而，我们置之不理。

Well, I believe that our identity is at risk, that when we actually don't care about these difficult things, the positive and wonderful things are nonetheless implicated. We love innovation. We love technology. We love creativity. We love entertainment. But ultimately, those realities are shadowed by suffering, abuse, degradation, marginalization. And for me, it becomes necessary to integrate the two, because ultimately, we are talking about a need to be more hopeful, more committed, more dedicated to the basic challenges of living in a complex world. And for me, that means spending time thinking and talking about the poor, the disadvantaged, those who will never get to TED, but thinking about them in a way that is integrated in our own lives.

我相信我们有自我定位危机。当我们不在乎这些艰难的事情时，正面和美好的事物也会受到牵连。我们热爱创新，我们热爱科技，我们热爱创意。我们热爱娱乐。但是到最后，这些美好的现实会因为苦难，伤害，堕落，忽视而蒙受阴影。对我而言，同时面对美好和艰难的事，是无法避免的。毕竟到头来我们关注的是生活在复杂的世界，如何充满希望，坚定且专注的 处理所有遭遇的挑战。这代表要花时间思考和谈论有关这些贫困，屈居劣势，永远不可能参加TED演讲的人们。要将他们纳入我们生活思考中的一部分。

You know, ultimately, we all have to believe things we haven't seen. We do. As rational as we are, as committed to intellect as we are, innovation, creativity, development comes not from the ideas in our mind alone. They come from the ideas in our mind that are also fueled by some conviction in our heart. And it's that mind-heart connection that I believe compels us to not just be attentive to all the bright and dazzly things, but also the dark and difficult things. Václav Havel, the great Czech leader, talked about this. He said, "When we were in Eastern Europe and dealing with oppression, we wanted all kinds of things. But mostly what we needed was hope, an orientation of the spirit, a willingness to sometimes be in hopeless places and be a witness."

基于我们具有的理性和智慧，我们终究必须相信这些我们不曾见到的事。发明、创造力和发展进化的能力不单单只是靠人类脑中的智力空想而来。在脑中形成的想法，其实会受到心里的信念刺激而产生。我相信就是这脑力和信念的结合，会迫使我们不只是注意光明璀璨的事情，也关心这些黑暗且困难的事情。VaclavHavel，捷克的伟大领导者，也如此说过。他说：「当我们在东欧面对压迫时，我们祈求各种东西，但我们最需要的是希望，一种精神的方针，让我们愿意处于绝望的地方，当一位目击者。」

Well, that orientation of the spirit is very much at the core of what I believe even TED communities have to be engaged in. There is no disconnect around technology and design that will allow us to be fully human until we pay attention to suffering, to poverty, to exclusion, to unfairness, to injustice. Now, I will warn you that this kind of identity is a much more challenging identity than ones that don't pay attention to this. It will get to you.

这精神方针就是我的信仰中心，即使是TED社群们都必须要参与。只要我们能开始去关心这些苦难贫困，排斥，不公平，不正义，现代科技和崭新的工艺设计，也不会消磨我们的人性，我们会成为更完整的人。现在我要提醒你们的是，开始有了这种自我定位的觉醒，会比未曾意识到之前更具挑战性。它会影响你。

I had the great privilege, when I was a young lawyer, of meeting Rosa Parks. And Ms. Parks used to come back to Montgomery every now and then, and she would get together with two of her dearest friends, these older women, Johnnie Carr, who was the organizer of the Montgomery bus boycott -- amazing African American woman -- and Virginia Durr, a white woman, whose husband, Clifford Durr, represented Dr. King. And these women would get together and just talk.

当我还是一个年轻律师时，我有幸认识RosaParks。Parks女士有时会到蒙哥马利，和两个好朋友聚会聊天，这些年长的女人，包括JohnnieCarr，蒙哥马利巴士抵制事件的发起人之一，令人钦佩的非裔美国女士。还有VirginiaDurr，一位白人女士，她的丈夫，ClifforDurr，曾代表马丁路德金恩博士。这些女士会聚在一起聊天。

And every now and then Ms. Carr would call me, and she'd say, "Bryan, Ms. Parks is coming to town. We're going to get together and talk. Do you want to come over and listen?" And I'd say, "Yes, ma'am, I do." She'd say, "What are you going to do when you get here?" I said, "I'm going to listen." And I'd go over there and I would, I'd just listen. It would be so energizing and so empowering.

Carr女士有时会打电话给我，她说：「Bryan，Parks女士要到镇上来，我们要聚会。你想要过来听听我们说些什么吗？」我说：「好的，女士，我会去。」她问：「那你来了要做什么？」我说：「我会静静地听。」当我加入聚会，我就是聆听。这样的聚会总是让我深受激励，且充满力量。

And one time I was over there listening to these women talk, and after a couple of hours, Ms. Parks turned to me and said, "Bryan, tell me what the Equal Justice Initiative is. Tell me what you're trying to do." And I began giving her my rap. "We're trying to challenge injustice. We're trying to help people who have been wrongly convicted. We're trying to confront bias and discrimination in the administration of criminal justice. We're trying to end life without parole sentences for children. We're trying to do something about the death penalty. We're trying to reduce the prison population. We're trying to end mass incarceration."

有一次当我在听这些女士说话，过了几个小时候，Parks女士转向我，她说：「Bryan，司法正义精神是什么，告诉我你打算怎么做。」我开始我的饶舌演说。我说：「我们试着挑战不正义。 我们试着帮助被误判的罪犯。我们试着对抗刑法审判时的偏见和歧视。我们试着终结对小孩判终身不得假释的审判。我们试着处理死刑这个议题。 我们试着降低监狱人数。 结束大量判刑的情况。」

I gave her my whole rap, and when I finished she looked at me and she said, "Mmm mmm mmm. That's going to make you tired, tired, tired." And that's when Ms. Carr leaned forward, she put her finger in my face, she said, "That's why you've got to be brave, brave, brave."

当我结束整段的说唱时，她看着我，然后她说：「嗯嗯嗯。」她说：「这会让你很累，很累，很累。」这个时候Carr女士倾身向前，指着我，她说，「这就是为什么你一定要勇敢，很勇敢，非常勇敢。」

And I actually believe that the TED community needs to be more courageous. We need to find ways to embrace these challenges, these problems, the suffering. Because ultimately, our humanity depends on everyone's humanity. I've learned very simple things doing the work that I do. It's just taught me very simple things. I've come to understand and to believe that each of us is more than the worst thing we've ever done. I believe that for every person on the planet.

而我相信TED也是一个勇敢社群。我们必须找到方法接受这些挑战，面对这些问题，苦难。 因为最终，我们的人道精神决定在每个人的人道精神。从我从事的工作中，我学到了非常简单的事情。 我了解且相信我们每个人的价值不单单取决于我们曾做过最坏的事。我相信地球上每个人皆是如此。

I think if somebody tells a lie, they're not just a liar. I think if somebody takes something that doesn't belong to them, they're not just a thief. I think even if you kill someone, you're not just a killer. And because of that, there's this basic human dignity that must be respected by law. I also believe that in many parts of this country, and certainly in many parts of this globe, that the opposite of poverty is not wealth. I don't believe that. I actually think, in too many places, the opposite of poverty is justice.

如果有人说谎，不代表他就只是一个骗子。如果有人拿了不属于他们的东西，不代表他们就只是小偷。即使你杀了人，也不意味着你只是一个凶手。就因如此，法律一定要尊重基本的人类尊严。我也相信在这个国家的很多地方，还有一定也在这个地球上很多地方，贫穷的相反不是富有。我不相信这个。事实上，我觉得在太多地方，贫穷的相反是正义。

And finally, I believe that, despite the fact that it is so dramatic and so beautiful and so inspiring and so stimulating, we will ultimately not be judged by our technology, we won't be judged by our design, we won't be judged by our intellect and reason. Ultimately, you judge the character of a society not by how they treat their rich and the powerful and the privileged, but by how they treat the poor, the condemned, the incarcerated. Because it's in that nexus that we actually begin to understand truly profound things about who we are.

最后，我相信尽管我们的科技引人注目，耀眼而激励人心，又这么具有启发性，但评断一个社会的品格，不是依据科技发展，不是依据我们的智商和理性。也不是观察他们对待富有、权贵人士的方式。最终，评断一个社会的品格，而是看他们如何对待穷困，被谴责，和被监禁的人的方式。因为就是在这些关系里，我们才会开始了解我们自己是谁这类深奥的事情。

I sometimes get out of balance. I'll end with this story. I sometimes push too hard. I do get tired, as we all do. Sometimes those ideas get ahead of our thinking in ways that are important. And I've been representing these kids who have been sentenced to these very harsh sentences. And I go to the jail and I see my client, who's 13 and 14, and he's been certified to stand trial as an adult. I start thinking, well, how did that happen? How can a judge turn you into something that you're not? And the judge has certified him as an adult, but I see this kid.

当然我有时候也会感到不平衡。我用一个故事来结尾。我有时候操之过急。我真的觉得劳累，每个人都会。有时候思考的速度追不上脑中的想法，结果是很严重的。我一直在担任这些被判重刑的小孩的律师。当我去看守所，我看到只有13或14岁的孩子， 被要求以大人身分出庭受审。 我开始在想，到底发生了什么事？一个法官怎么可以把你变成另一个不同的身分？当法官证实他是个成人时，我看到个却是个小孩。

And I was up too late one night and I started thinking, well, if the judge can turn you into something you're not, the judge must have magic power. Yeah, Bryan, the judge has some magic power. You should ask for some of that. And because I was up too late and wasn't thinking real straight, I started working on a motion. I had a client who was 14 years old, a young, poor Black kid. And I started working on this motion, and the head of the motion was: "Motion to try my poor, 14-year-old Black male client like a privileged, white, 75-year-old corporate executive."

有一天晚上，我很晚还没睡，然后我开始在想，天啊，如果法官可以把你变成另一个根本不是你的身分，那么法官一定有神奇的魔力。好棒啊，Bryan，法官有神奇的魔力。你应该要跟他讨一些魔力的。因为我太晚还没睡，我其实在胡思乱想。我开始起草一份议案。我有一个14岁的客户，一个年轻，贫困的黑人男孩。 我接着写这份议案，议案的主旨是：「请视我的被告，穷困，14岁的黑人男孩子，如同一位有特权的，75岁白人企业经理。」

And I put in my motion that there was prosecutorial misconduct and police misconduct and judicial misconduct. There was a crazy line in there about how there's no conduct in this county, it's all misconduct. And the next morning, I woke up and I thought, now, did I dream that crazy motion, or did I actually write it? And to my horror, not only had I written it, but I had sent it to court.

接着我在诉讼议案中写到此案中检察官，警察，法院都处置不当。还说了这个州管理不当之类的疯言疯语，总之就是从头错到尾。隔天早上，我起床后开始在想，是我做梦梦到这个疯狂的议案？还是我真的写了一份？令我震惊的是，我不只写了，我还把它传给法院了。

A couple months went by, and I just had forgotten all about it. And I finally decided, "Gosh, I've got to go to the court and do this crazy case." And I got in my car, and I was feeling really overwhelmed -- overwhelmed. And I got in my car and went to this courthouse. And I was thinking, this is going to be so difficult, so painful. And I finally got out of the car and started walking up to the courthouse.

几个月过去，我完全忘记这件事，然后我最后决定，天啊，我必须去法院处理这疯狂的案子。于是我走进我的车，当下我真的觉得非常不知所措。前往法院途中，我在想，这将会非常困难，非常痛苦。当我下车，走向法院。

And as I was walking up the steps, there was an older Black man who was the janitor in this courthouse. When this man saw me, he came over and said, "Who are you?" I said, "I'm a lawyer." He said, "You're a lawyer?" I said, "Yes, sir." And this man came over to me, and he hugged me. And he whispered in my ear. He said, "I'm so proud of you." And I have to tell you, it was energizing. It connected deeply with something in me about identity, about the capacity of every person to contribute to community, to a perspective that is hopeful.

踏上法院的阶梯时，有一个年老的黑人法院清洁工。当他看到我时，他走过来，他说：「你是谁？」我说：「我是律师。」他说：「你是律师？」我说：「是的，先生。」 然后这位男士靠近我， 给了我一个拥抱。 他在我耳边低语。 他说：「我真为你感到骄傲。」 我必须跟你们说，这让我精神一振。他触动了我内心深处的自我定位。我相信每个人都有能力可以贡献人群，可以做有希望的事。

Well, I went into the courtroom. And as soon as I walked in, the judge saw me coming. He said, "Mr. Stevenson, did you write this crazy motion?" I said, "Yes, sir. I did." And we started arguing. And people started coming in, just outraged I'd written these crazy things. And police officers were coming in and assistant prosecutors and clerk workers. Before I knew it, the courtroom was filled with people angry that we were talking about race, that we were talking about poverty, talking about inequality.

于是我走进法庭。当法官看到我，他问：「Stevenson先生，是你写了这份疯狂的议案吗？」我说，「是的，先生，我写的。」，然后我们开始争论。义愤填膺的群众开始进入法庭，我写了这些疯狂的东西。警察进来了，助理检察官和办事员也都进来。在我注意到之前，法庭里已经挤满了愤怒的群众。因为我们谈论种族，谈论贫穷，谈论不平等的问题。

And out of the corner of my eye, I could see this janitor pacing back and forth. He kept looking through the window and could hear all the holler. And finally, this older Black man with a very worried look on his face came into the courtroom and sat behind me, almost at counsel table. Ten minutes later, the judge said we'd take a break. During the break, there was a deputy sheriff who was offended that the janitor had come into court. The deputy jumped up and ran over to this older Black man. He said, "Jimmy, what are you doing in this courtroom?" And this older Black man stood up and looked at that deputy and he looked at me, and he said, "I came into this courtroom to tell this young man, 'Keep your eyes on the prize, hold on.'"

我用眼角余光看见清洁工来回踱步。他一直透过窗户看进来。他可听到这些叫喊声。他不停地来回踱步。最后，这位年老的黑人脸上挂着担心的表情走进法庭且坐在我后面，几乎碰到律师桌。大概十分钟后，法官宣布休息。休息时有位副警长因为清洁工进到法庭中发起脾气。他跳起来跑向这位年长的黑人。他说：「Jimmy，你在法庭里做什么？」这位年长黑人站起身，他看着警长也看着我，他说：「我进到法庭来，为了告诉这位年轻男士，专注在你的目标，坚持下去。」

I've come to TED because I believe that many of you understand that the moral arc of the universe is long, but it bends toward justice; that we cannot be full, evolved human beings until we care about human rights and basic dignity; that all of our survival is tied to the survival of everyone; that our visions of technology and design and entertainment and creativity have to be married with visions of humanity, compassion and justice. And more than anything, for those of you who share that, I've simply come to tell you to keep your eyes on the prize, hold on.Thank you very much.

我来到TED，因为我相信你们当中很多人了解宇宙的道德弧形很长，但它是朝向正义弯曲的。如果我们不在乎人权和生命基本尊严，我们就无法完全进化。全人类的生存和每一个人的生存紧紧相扣。我们对科技和工艺设计，娱乐和创意的看法，都必须结合对人性、怜悯和正义的看法。最重要的是，对你们当中也抱持同样看法的人，我来的目的是要告诉你们，专注在你的目标，坚持下去。非常感谢大家。

Chris Anderson: Brian, so you heard and saw an obvious desire by this audience, this community, to help you on your way and to do something on this issue. Other than writing a check, what could we do?

CA：你可以听到也看到这些观众，这个社群，显然很希望能在这个议题上和你站在一起。除了开张支票之外，我们还可以做什么？

BS: Well, there are opportunities all around us. If you live in the state of California, for example, there's a referendum coming up this spring where there's going to be an effort to redirect some of the money we spend on the politics of punishment. For example, here in California, we're going to spend one billion dollars on the death penalty in the next five years -- one billion dollars. And yet, 46 percent of all homicide cases don't result in arrest, 56 percent of all rape cases don't result. So there's an opportunity to change that. And this referendum would propose having those dollars go to law enforcement and safety. And I think that opportunity exists all around us.

我们周遭有很多机会。举例来说，如果你住在加州，这个春天即将有一个公投决定是否要重新分配一些我们原本花费在刑罚操作的经费。例如，在加州，未来五年内，我们将花十亿美元在死刑上十亿美元。然而，百分之四十六的杀人案件并没有逮捕到犯人。百分之五十六的强暴案没有破案。所以是有机会可以改变的。这个公投提议将这些金钱投入落实法律和安全。我想机会存在我们周遭。

CA: There's been this huge decline in crime in America over the last three decades. And part of the narrative of that is sometimes that it's about increased incarceration rates. What would you say to someone who believed that?

在过去的三十年来，美国的犯罪率有显著的下降。有部分的看法是这跟提高的监禁率有关。你会怎么跟持有这种看法的人解释？

BS: Well, actually, the violent crime rate has remained relatively stable. The great increase in mass incarceration in this country wasn't really in violent crime categories. It was this misguided war on drugs. That's where the dramatic increases have come in our prison population.And we got carried away with the rhetoric of punishment.

事实上美国暴力犯罪的数字一直没有多大变动。大量增加的服刑人口，并不是来自暴力犯罪，而是毒品犯罪。那是我们的监狱人口剧增的原因。

And so we have "Three Strikes" laws that put people in prison forever for stealing a bicycle, for low-level property crimes, rather than making them give those resources back to the people who they victimized. I believe we need to do more to help people who are victimized by crime, not do less. And I think our current punishment philosophy does nothing for no one. And I think that's the orientation that we have to change.

我们被花俏的判刑名词冲昏了头，例如我们用三振出局法严惩惯犯将偷脚踏车或廉价物品的罪犯判终身监禁，而不是让他们去弥补受害者。我相信我们需要做的是给予犯罪受害人更多帮助，不是只着重在严惩罪犯。我们现有的刑罚思考哲学对任何人都没有好处。所以我认为这个大方向需要改变。

CA: Bryan, you've struck a massive chord here. You're an inspiring person. Thank you so much for coming to TED. Thank you.

BS: Thank you. Thank you.

Bryan，你的演说动人心弦。你是个能激发人心的人。非常谢谢你来到TED。

谢谢。谢谢。